Euro Tail Lights!!!!!!! [Archive]

UNCTYPE-S

09-15-2002, 10:06 PM

everybody is talking about how us ga's should be like family. Well why do the *** owners get to see them before the non *** owners. I understand i guess that the *** people can buy them first but why cant the non *** owners at least see a pic so we can see what they look like?? Im not saying this is any type of segregation, but lately all ive heard is that these tails are awesome and their worth the money. And all those responses have came from *** owners. My opinion, i just dont think its fair.

resevil83

09-15-2002, 10:17 PM

yea lol.. I think thats rather childish... the guys from *** must be on crack... we've all been waiting for sooooo long now, what's the big deal with seeing them? It's not like we can go make them outta our fricken garage lol. To me a 18 year old.. it makes no sense what so ever... Actually that is the absolute dumbest thing I've ever heard.. Im sorry for rantin this is my own opinion.. But I think I can speak for all of us non-*** owners that we WANT to seeeeee the tails... And you can get each tail for like 80 bones at gmpartsdirect.com also 500 dollars for tails is ridiculous.. 200 250 would be a very good price... I gaurentee it did not cost them near 150 dollars to make both tales. and they still will be makin money...

PBergstr

09-15-2002, 10:18 PM

Dude, I've seen them, trust me.. they are SO worth it!!

This *** Owner thinks they rock and consequetnly purchased set # 2

~PhAt

PBergstr

09-15-2002, 10:23 PM

Well.. i have a few things to say about that

Ive seen the price list for everything len used to make these tails.. and it cost him dayam near 500. They are EXTREMLY high quality and nothing like what youve seen before or what you can possibly be expecting!
The reason he isnt holding off to release them to the rest of you is so that when we (members) drive around with our new tailz people will see us and be like DAYAM thats cool.. just something special/nice he's doing for us to thank us for supporting him and susanna all these years! believe me.. I'm grateful

UNCTYPE-S

09-15-2002, 10:31 PM

but the point of getting the word out is to have as many ga's with them on as possible. I mean if you look at it this way, if they want to get the word out, their only relying on the *** owners to spread the word around for a month or 2. And lets say that 200 *** owners have them on and driving around their areas. Thats cool in all but if they wanted to get the word out that ga finally has tails they should sell them to all ga owners so that instead of 200 people showing them off, it would be like 500 or more. The #'s arent exact cause i dont know the number of people on these boards as well as *** owners, but you get the point.

UNCTYPE-S

09-15-2002, 10:32 PM

forgot to mention, that nobody has still answered my question about why us non *** owners cant at least see the tails.

GrandAmSC/T

09-15-2002, 10:41 PM

**** that 500 for tail lights is insane :rage: *** is just ripping everybody off, i realize getting stuff for domestic cars isnt cheap but geez..... count me OUT

that and they only release it first to *** owners, thats not how you do business. That just ticks people off, im not an *** owner but that just makes me feel low like there not good enuff for me cause i havent bought any of their overpriced fiberglass, well if they werent so biast maybe i would. p i s s on them.

papiogagt

09-15-2002, 10:45 PM

i will NEVER see them if it's just *** owner's getting them, well, the earliest would be GAP '03 if i go because there are no *** owner's where i live. i'm sure that's the same for many on here. i think they should at least get a pic. if they are worried about apc stealing the idea.. i highly doubt that apc would put the time and effort into coming up w/ their own plans and molds and get these out before the *** so that people think *** stole the design from apc. apc just doesn't have the high quality to do somethig like that. just my $.02. still can't wait to see them though, even if it is on an ***!

VTECSiGAH8R

09-15-2002, 10:59 PM

Originally posted by UNC0808
forgot to mention, that nobody has still answered my question about why us non *** owners cant at least see the tails.

I think what they are doing is fair. Most of the time, people on these board whine about how they would instantly pay for this or that and they would love to have someone make a part for them, and if only someone would make that part, that so many people would buy it that it would become very profitable. then the item is made, and 2 people buy it. Of course this is exaggerated, but u get the point? They are showing and offering the clear tails which are of high quality and high expense only to people that have committed to them before by buying the *** kits. These people are likely to commit again because they understand the hard work that goes into making cool products for only a small number of people enough to spend 500 bux on them, which is what I have been reading so far.

Anyway, if they get a bunch of people to buy it to begin with, they can show it off in tandem with their body kits, thus making people to really want the lights, and possibly the body kit too. And when people get time to see them for months on cars, then they themselves will want it and will have had time to save up for the tails. Thus they could sell more when it is released to everyone else.

This is all not to mention that if they could sell a lot of lights to *** owners, then maybe the kit will drop in price when it goes for general release. Don't forget too that these are LED lights, BTW.

That is the impression I got from this whole thing. Also, I included a pic that was put up on the general section of the *** clears. I'm not positive if it is the exact final product or even the actual ones at all or what, but it looks cool. I got it from a pic posted on a general thread about *** lights, posted by GrandAmSC/T. I thought they were supposed to be online yet or something??

http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/attachment.php?s=&postid=14856

resevil83

09-15-2002, 11:09 PM

ok I am sorry but the guy from florida must be thinking too (i cant spell) hard.. He has a point and all but hear me out... If you show all the ga owners your tail lights I tell you now that *** will make 1000000 times as much as if they were just to put it out to *** owners.. I dont care how many people u say will buy the *** tails that dont own the *** kit... but I bet you that more people that dont own *** kits will buy the tails then *** owners... and if that is not true then the one person that does buy the tails that doesnt own the kit will still be giving his/her money to ***... whats the problem with that? if the tails are so high quality and do cost that much to make.... then fine... i'll take them but you'd have to give me a while... wait are they not offered to me? :eek: burned

GrandAmSC/T

09-15-2002, 11:18 PM

i feel ya resevil83 i feel burned too. Like i said were not good enough for *** cause we havent bought anything in the past. SO they are playing biast games with us and not selling to us with the rest. That is NOT how you do business, not to mention i could probably contact the BBB right now and report them in for being how they are, but ill leave that up to someone else. *** is a small company and it will continue to stay small not for the reason of people not modding Grand ams as oppossed to Civics but for the mere principle of their business practices. They operate that way and they are way overpriced so just let the *** boys with money to throw away keep them in business.
Like i said earlier my opinion is P I S S on ***

VTECSiGAH8R

09-16-2002, 12:09 AM

Originally posted by GrandAmSC/T
i feel ya resevil83 i feel burned too. Like i said were not good enough for *** cause we havent bought anything in the past. SO they are playing biast games with us and not selling to us with the rest. That is NOT how you do business, not to mention i could probably contact the BBB right now and report them in for being how they are, but ill leave that up to someone else. *** is a small company and it will continue to stay small not for the reason of people not modding Grand ams as oppossed to Civics but for the mere principle of their business practices. They operate that way and they are way overpriced so just let the *** boys with money to throw away keep them in business.
Like i said earlier my opinion is P I S S on ***

LOL, go ahead and call the BBB and they'll laugh in ur face. Ur making way to big of a deal outta this. A lot of people consider Altezas GAY! They consider them semething that Honda-Japanese car boys get and will always associate them with being a stupid mod. *** didn't have to do crap for the people on these boards. And yet they are the only ones that make a body kit for the GA, albeit an expensive one.

All they have to say if the BBB tried to contact them is that they want to test it out on cars outfitted with their kits first to make sure that it is a nice combination for the car for people that might want to get the kit and lights together, and that no further mods will be needed. I can understand how ur upset, but I wasn't putting too much thought into this, it was all logical to me from the beginning. Many people on these boards ask for something and then never buy it when it is made.

Case in point, how many people bought the DRL kit??? How many people complain over and over about how much they want a carbon fiber hood but don't want to front the money or the necessary donor hood?? How about this. Can you really tell me that u have $500 for clear tails to spend right now without thinking if the light looks good on ur car or not, or whether they are worth it or whether u'll need the money for bills, other mods, etc.??? I'd bet most of u can't.

And if u just say that you would buy one now that I ask if you would, just to prove me wrong, then Why The **** were u bitching just a few posts ago about the price??

Dr_Kyle

09-16-2002, 12:45 AM

lol $500?!?!?!? lol NO WAY!! $350 would even be pushing it. I can't believe they expect $500 for a pair of tailz. lol What a freakin JOKE!

resevil83

09-16-2002, 12:45 AM

ok I'll say this.... I thought the tails were overpriced but who am i to say.. so i take it back I aplogize butttttt if the tails did cost 100 bucks to make and tehy are chargin 500 then i say i wont buy... if they tails are REALLY that expensive to make adn blood and tears went into them sure if they look good I'll get htem.... right now i have around 750 in cash in front of me..... what to spend it on??? :) im thinking about a car stereo at this moment.

GrandAmSC/T

09-16-2002, 12:45 AM

yea your probably right the BBB would probably laugh, but whether they do or not its still the concept of it all. For one how they are handling the situation its ****ed me off and im sure a handful of others. I guess im just not seeing the reasoning behind letting the *** owners get first dibs. That just isnt how you conduct business. But what do i know.

And yeah i have noticed how everybody always wants everything and then never buys it, some people are just lame enough to sit behind a computer and say they want something and not pull through with it. Probably because saying you want it on a message board isnt signing a legal binding contract that i know of. But that has nothing to do with what im trying to say. If they arent going to release it to the General public at once then they shouldnt at all. I know big businesses often release their products out beforehand to employees or often a discount but this is diffrent, *** is being biast and releasing it out to the general public, but picking and choosing people that can have the lights first.

ANd yeah i have 500 bucks to spend on something, but im not going to spend it on outrageous priced clear tail lights especially from a company that conducts business like they do. Not to mention if they are like the picture that i posted hell no you can tell me all day that it cost *** almost 500 bucks to make those things and ill laugh in your face becasue i dont believe that. Those lights are nice, but they arent 500 bucks nice. *** might have told your poor souls that or even wrote it on paper, but if i tell you im flying to the moon next week will you believe that too? If they are too good to release their product to everybody then im too good to buy their stuff. But if you want to buy the gay tails go for it better you getting ripped off than me. Thats all my opinion, some people will understand where im coming from here.

VTECSiGAH8R

09-16-2002, 01:10 AM

GrandAmSC/T, are you aware that the grey area in the tails in ur pic is going to be colored to match the car or chromed?? That is what is probably making it cost so much. How many other Clear tails have u seeen that offer coloring in that area??

Anyway, I was figuring that someone would say they had the money in front of them, of course nothing about having to spend it on other stuff which u most likely will have to do with it unless u have been saving $500 for these lights for a long time even tho the price was only announced recently.

I bet even if they did offer it to everybody, u would say "$500 is too much to pay for those lights" cuz like I said, people that haven't bought from *** b4 might not know the quality or effort that goes into making their products, and thus wouldn't understand the price. I think ur taking what would sound like a whiny cost issue, and making it into what sounds like a legitimate question of business practice.

It may not be the smartest business practice in the world, but the bottom line is that if *** wants to do it they'll do it. Personally I would have immediately thought that $500 is too much if they offered it to everyone at once, but this way, I would look at it as a chance to save up $500 for it rather than going a month without electricity or A/C just so that i can be one of the first few that gets it.

SpyhunteR

09-16-2002, 01:11 AM

Man I wanted a fukkin carb hood forever. I have the money to front for a hood, I have the hood to fork over as well. I could give a damn if anybody else has the cash for it. I want the damn hood. I'd pay $900 for a carbon hood. Will anybody make one for me? NOOOOO ... Why? because I have ****ty enthusiasts who I am surrounded by who are interested in the CHEAPEST way to get their car going 2/10th's quicker... WTF IS UP W/ THAT!?

I'll agree that the lights are hella expensive, so is doing a HID conversion on your headlights. Man our aftermarket has barely started. Maybe if the tails were more along the lines of $300 I would be thinking HMMMMM nice lights i might buy a set. Sorry guys but you screw yourselves. By complaining abou unfair business practices and crappy prices. Maybe if you were a little enthusiastic about things you'll realize there's more to being an enthusiast than having ****ty 15.5+ second cars...

Personally I'm stuck going custom on a lot of things because of a ****ty support base...

Thanks a bunch gusy. Oh and that taillight pic is very nice albeit $500 I personally will spend it elsewheres, like a new 3inch exhaust...

GrandAmSC/T

09-16-2002, 01:49 AM

Originally posted by VTECSiGAH8R
GrandAmSC/T, are you aware that the grey area in the tails in ur pic is going to be colored to match the car or chromed?? That is what is probably making it cost so much. How many other Clear tails have u seeen that offer coloring in that area??

Anyway, I was figuring that someone would say they had the money in front of them, of course nothing about having to spend it on other stuff which u most likely will have to do with it unless u have been saving $500 for these lights for a long time even tho the price was only announced recently.

I bet even if they did offer it to everybody, u would say "$500 is too much to pay for those lights" cuz like I said, people that haven't bought from *** b4 might not know the quality or effort that goes into making their products, and thus wouldn't understand the price. I think ur taking what would sound like a whiny cost issue, and making it into what sounds like a legitimate question of business practice.

It may not be the smartest business practice in the world, but the bottom line is that if *** wants to do it they'll do it. Personally I would have immediately thought that $500 is too much if they offered it to everyone at once, but this way, I would look at it as a chance to save up $500 for it rather than going a month without electricity or A/C just so that i can be one of the first few that gets it.

Yes i was aware of the coloring. I havent seen any clear tails like these but still they arent 500 bucks cool! end of story. im like everybody else i think 350 is pushing it but i would probably fork over 350 bucks for these. But im not forking over 500 Sorry!

And no im not using the business practice excuse as a way to make the price issue not sound so dumb. Ive been seeing the business issue of theirs go on forever and its just been silently screwing with me and it finally ticked me off after i heard about them doing it again. For example look at their *** hoods that are only set out to be a member product. Another very expensive *** item... How many of these things have you seen roaming around? ive seen ONE. Maybe if they let it out for EVERYONE to buy more might be roaming on cars. Not only are they hurting themselves but ****ing off other possible future buyers. I guess either the price will go down or once i see them actually on a car they will grow on me and ill decide their worth 500 bucks but until then nope.

SikMindz

09-16-2002, 02:22 AM

Well first off the tails will be sold as the pictures show however in pieces. You will have to paint them or dip them on your own AFTER ordering them. However, if you are to provide colored plastic to *** prior to them being made they will make the lens whichever color plasitc you sent (them which is pretty trick, IMO.) Also, you will be sent the tails disassembled and will have to assemble them on your own, and there are more than enough opportunities in that to customize them and make them "you."

Onto the next subject though. First people complain about having the SC/T hood offered by GM as an option, as then it would lose its rarity. Then people start complaining about the *** hood being TOO exclusive. I don't get it...

GrandAmSC/T

09-16-2002, 03:40 AM

the only cool thing about them is they let you customize them but geez for 500 bucks they should customize them. They should also come painted for that much.

I NEVER complained about the *** hood being too exclusive i used it as an example of their business. I pretty much said it needs to be more exclusive. They only have it out to members thats WHY there is only a few around. Like i said earlier IF they would release their products to the general public from the start they would have more products out, make more money, and get their name out more- thus increasing business and profits and ****ing less people off like myself.

But im not a big shot here i have no say in anything but what I think. So let them be idiots. Screw it why do i care.

GregFarz78

09-16-2002, 06:38 AM

Damn $500 and they arent even assembled? You have to customize them yourself? Looks like everyone will be having the same condensation problem the hot wheels ga has with its clear tails. They look nice and all but its a lot of dough for a peice of plastic.

iceman

09-16-2002, 11:51 AM

Ok I won't even talk about price...

But I think it's a great thing that the housings can be painted to match the color of the car they are going on. I think the biggest reason most aftermarket tails look like crap is because of the shiny fake chrome housings they come in. They just don't match the car... SOMETIMES they look good on silver or white cars, but they just stick out too much. These tails would look great body-matched.

And everyone complaining about condensation, water, blah blah. Obviously if you are spending 500 bucks on unpainted body parts, you are going to have a body shop paint and install these... I'm sure they are more than capable of assembling these and sealing them correctly..

resevil83

09-16-2002, 12:13 PM

"Anyway, I was figuring that someone would say they had the money in front of them, of course nothing about having to spend it on other stuff which u most likely will have to do with it unless u have been saving $500 for these lights for a long time even tho the price was only announced recently."
I can't believe you dude? I don't know what you are trying to say... but let me put it this way. I never knew the price of the tails till recently.. I did say I was most likely going to buy something else, I have been saving for my car is what I was doing. And also spyhunter out of all people.. Why would you say we are ****ty enthusiasts **** man you jag lol, look at how many fing people are on this board... Jeremy and his buddy set up a wonderful site where we can all get along and talk about our cars non-stop... You can't tell me that we are bad enthusiasts. me you and everyone in the world wishes they could do something cheap to their car to get it .2 tenths faster. On the track every tenth counts, you know that. I don't see your relevance... Just for you to tell me that me or anyone on the board is a bad enthusiast makes a mea wanna jack ya... but no I wanna start an internet fight!!! lol come on man... why even say that.... and call the grand am ****ty.... you own one bro.. Ga's are good for what you pay. The tails forget talking about them lets just wait till *** says something...

gagt17

09-16-2002, 12:27 PM

ok, i've been a member on this site for almost 3 years now. i may not post a lot, but i read almost every thread and i have learned more here than I ever expected. one thing that i've learned is that there are sooo many members that post here that just cannot be pleased, no matter what. people need to take a step back and think about what they are bitching over. quit wasting the time and effort of the enthusiasts that were able to get these parts produced, by bitching because it wasn't made this way or costs too much or isn't available to you the same time as someone else... guess what, they didn't have YOU in mind when they made them. they made them for the people that have already shown they are ENTHUSIASTIC about their cars, not the people that want everything for next to nothing.

GrandAmSC/T

09-16-2002, 01:32 PM

well i guess im not ENTHUSIASTIC enough to buy the tails because i havent spent 2 grand on a body kit. I dont care what you all say this just isn't right. I guess ill just never be ENTHUSIASTIC enough to purchase anything from ***.

And no i dont want everything from next to nothing. I have NO problems with stuff being reasonable priced or slightly above reasonable, but 500 dollars for tail lights is outrageous, i asked a bunch of my friends today and funny they agreed with me. I realize were not driving civics here where there a dime a dozen and they probably sell 10 clear tails a day for those things which you can buy them for 100 bucks a pop, but i DO think 500 bucks is outrageous for some mother****ing lights that arent even painted or put together that look like **** anyways. But if you want to pay 500 bucks more power to ya.

You wont have to worry about *** saying anything about the tails, *** is too worried about their daily customers than to stoop so low to talk to us or recruit new customers. Either that or they are too worried about getting the pics off the internet that i posted because we arent *** members so we rightfully cant see them? :mad:

*** sucks i boycott them. :rage: :nono:

resevil83

09-16-2002, 01:49 PM

I'm sorry once again I completely disagree with gagt 17 and completely agree with grandamsct this time round... come on I basically got done saying that NO ONE on this whole board has the right to say we are or aren't enthusiastic.. When the *** kit came out u had nooooo clue what I was thinking... but yes I was enthusiastic what a baskrjadkj :rage: umm im just not a cough :newbie: nor are u gagt17... ive also been here for 3 years when gagtcom first got up i was tehre... i was here before I even had a ga.. lol.. well anyways... it doesnt matter.. lets stop our bitching it does us no good... and keep pur opinions to ourselves.. this is my last post in this thread... im done being a fag... but hell whatever im just ognna laugh it up :o pshheww off to class

GregFarz78

09-16-2002, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by iceman
And everyone complaining about condensation, water, blah blah. Obviously if you are spending 500 bucks on unpainted body parts, you are going to have a body shop paint and install these... I'm sure they are more than capable of assembling these and sealing them correctly..

Good point add another $100 for that....$600 for tails that add 0 HP :rolleyes:

MidwestJosh

09-16-2002, 03:05 PM

Originally posted by GregFarz78

Good point add another $100 for that....$600 for tails that add 0 HP :rolleyes:

My thoughts exactly.

Cujo

09-16-2002, 03:47 PM

I am glad these taillights are now out but I too am dissappointed about the price and the fact they are not painted to begin with. Doesn't matter if I'm an enthuist or not, I still have a budget to work with. That's why I own a Grand Am and not something nice like a corvette or BMW. You think that for the amount of money I was buying parts for one of these luxury cars !! $600 american works out to be almost $1000 canadian. That's a freeaking hefty price tag for taillights. I will wait for APC and cross my fingers that they will look just as good but be more reasonably priced. And I bet those suckers won't need paint !

Cujo..

SpyhunteR

09-16-2002, 05:53 PM

I'm just also going to add. That there's no cheap way to go fast. There's just hard work and money. Our market is very small. It's a niche market. There's not much money to be made by making products for us. That's where price inflation comes in. When there's few of us, just having an item made costs much more. *** does have crappy business practice. Yet, if you really want your car to stand out enough than well go out there and do it. Why do you think we don't have much going for us? Look how many are representing on the show circuit? Not very many until just very recently. Maybe if people go out there and represent like I do, in any way shape or form we'd get noticed and demand would rise and the R&D departments of companys would notice more. Why do you think RKSPORT doesn't have anything for us? If anybody they should have something right? Well, they don't think there's enough of us out there to make a commitment on the car.

*** is only one company w/ one set of trick tails. Too pricey for me, but watch out my car has big surprises that's going to make everybody **** their pants when i'm done.

lrymal

09-16-2002, 07:01 PM

Originally posted by Cujo
...and the fact they are not painted to begin with. .....

I'm not sure why I'm thinking this, but I thought the photo was of a prototype tail.

PBergstr

09-16-2002, 07:38 PM

well in the photo they are grey, but the plastic will actually be black.. which wont look too bad and if you want to paint them it will look pretty good too!

~PhAt

MidwestJosh

09-16-2002, 08:04 PM

Originally posted by SpyhunteR

*** is only one company w/ one set of trick tails.

The only company that makes them for their previous customers that spent two grand already...

UNCTYPE-S

09-16-2002, 08:30 PM

*** might wanna ask themselves a question. If we want the word spread around, do we want 200 or so *** members to rely on the "spreading around", or do we want 500+ people with all types of ga's to represent. I dont get it at all. I hear so many times people saying, "hey guys stop arguing, were suppose to be a family full of ga's, we have to stick up for each other." Well then *** is not makin us look like a family if they want the *** owners to have them. Now im going to tell the truth, i dont think i will ever buy these tails for 500, no matter if their well worth it. I dont care if their made out of crystal, my POINT is, if we are such a "family", then we should be treated like one. Not just let the people that can afford the kit or even like the kit. There are a lot of people that dont have the money, and there are people that just have no interest in the kit, but that shouldnt take away from the non *** owners.

SikMindz

09-16-2002, 08:36 PM

Just FYI, the tails WILL be released to the general public eventually. Out of appreciation for prior customers however, the tails will be released to us first until a sufficient demand has been created for a general release. Prices WILL remain the same and judging by the responses now there is NO demand for them at this price. Just IMO, if the general public continues to complain about price, build quality, release dates and aesthetics, I doubt this product will come out anytime in the near future...

MidwestJosh

09-16-2002, 08:43 PM

Myself personally, I am not a body kit/wing/clear tail lights kind of person. I am only trying to make a point that their business practices aren't exactly the 'norm.'

The thing I don't understand is why it seems like everyone stands up for *** and all the threads about them that bash them get deleted, regardless of what forum it is. Just doesn't make sence to me. No company is perfect. How will a company know what it is they are doing wrong if threads keep getting deleted about peoples displeasure with them?

UNCTYPE-S

09-16-2002, 08:43 PM

i can understand alot of people getting upset cause the tails cost 500+ and they cant even see a picture. Maybe some people would take back what they say after they see a picture, but until then, i can see why so many people are complaining.

Now i dont own anything by ***, and ive heard lots of good things about them and some bad things, but why does it seem like their being discriminating.

UNCTYPE-S

09-16-2002, 08:47 PM

i agree with midwest josh, a company should hear both sides of the story and take it anyway they want. We have the right to speak any way we want as long as it is in the lines of being acceptable for this site. I think, this is just a topic that can go both ways, and *** can either forget about it and move on, or they can listen to the ga owners out there and listen to what they have to say.

SikMindz

09-16-2002, 08:57 PM

Well in my own defense, as my last post may have seemed a bit edgy, I will remain neutral on ALL *** discussions. I support this forum 100% but would be a fool to bite the proverbial hand that feeds me.

And to comment about deleted threads- *** owns the GMPower boards for the most part and are free to handle touchy threads as they feel. However, other boards, such as this very forum are privately owned obviously. Mods and admins here do not have to delete anything they feel should stay however, I suspect that they delete some threads as to not cause too much inter-turmoil within the GA community. :thumbs:

PBergstr

09-16-2002, 09:03 PM

The reason they are letting us (the owners) have the tailz/ see the tailz first, is because they want to thank us for all the support we have given them by allowing us to have these tails to ourselves for a month or two, that way when we go to shows we get that extra little point for the tails because no one else even knows what they look like! And i think thats ALLLLL right on lens part and i personally appreciate it! That is why, so you know, you will see them soon enough and its not like you wont see them until you fork out 500 bucks! besides, personally i think 500 is worth a bullseye turnsignal!! :)

PhAt

Grouch

09-16-2002, 10:08 PM

The thing I don't understand is why it seems like everyone stands up for *** and all the threads about them that bash them get deleted, regardless of what forum it is. Just doesn't make sence to me. No company is perfect. How will a company know what it is they are doing wrong if threads keep getting deleted about peoples displeasure with them?

:thumbs:

That is exactely my point that I have been trying to get across for several months. Most company's appreciate consumer critique/feedback as it allows them to improve and design things that the consumers want. *** is so close minded it isn't funny. Yeah they aren't gonna sell many of these as they have p***ed off a large majority of thier potential customers.

I have tried getting *** to answer a few questinos for me for several months. I have posted them on various forums and have been flamed and bashed myself from many others claiming that all I am doing is bashing ***. No, I just want these 5 simple questions answered. Many person's in the "pro-***" camp sees anything negative about *** it's automatically bashing. I have emailed *** about 2-weeks ago, still no response.

*** says thier cost are so high because there is not much of a demand. Guess what, read about the BASIC principles of Supply and Demand. Right now there is no demand because of the extrodinary prices and the attitudes of those in and around ***. Reduce the prices, improve customer service and the demand will go through the roof, listen to what your customers are saying. This is how you build a successful company and products. But you can't because a majority those threads and post are being deleted. I think those in *** might actually be blind to what all is going on in the real world.

However, other boards, such as this very forum are privately owned obviously. Mods and admins here do not have to delete anything they feel should stay however

*** has already thrown it's weight around outside of their little world and have had threads deleted, post removed, people banned. Complete bs. They have no right.

I've given up on ***. Until they have fixed their problems they will not get my $$$ and I will not recommend them to anyone.

And one more thing, SikMindz, I apologize for all the crap that happened in the thread last night. It was not meant to come off as blaming or anything. It was just a quick cut and paste. I had just come from GMPower where they had deleted a bunch of threads and post (again) and I was upset. :cool:

PBergstr

09-16-2002, 11:02 PM

okay grouch, i dont mean to be a prick or anything, because really im not tryin to be, but 1. do you have any idea what it costs to develope, design and build molds/machines to produce a fiberglass (glass in itself is expensive) body kit? Especially at such a risk to yourself! *** had one before this one and it flopped, Len did nto like it at all and totally redesigned it. Also.. what are your questions!?? send them to me and i will do my best to find out answers for you, even if it requires calling len

Patrick

Josh

09-16-2002, 11:03 PM

Hey Guys this is 96whitegagt from GMPOWER and I am a moderator there! I am the one who deleted all of the posts there! I am sorry if I offended anyone! But I am doing my job and trying to keep some people from some trouble. I am sorry that you all dont agree with what I did. I have some things for you all to think about!

* If I don't have any money to get a new computer, What do I do? I definatly would not go to a computer forum and bitch and moan about not being able to afford it because I don't have enough money. Who's fault is that? It is not the products company's fault. Also the tails were wilth held to the general public due to the fact that *** was wanting to debut them @ SEMA this year. I am sorry once again! But that is my view on that topic.

*** Has my respect till the day I get rid of my grand am!

I would say to you guys here and over @ GMPOWERTALK to all grow up! and act more mature.

Have a nice night!

Josh Combs
(96whitegagt)

PBergstr

09-16-2002, 11:04 PM

and another thing, Josh is the man, hes a great guy, and he's just doing his part to stick up for ***, there is a difference between critqueing and slandering! :)

Patrick

UNCTYPE-S

09-16-2002, 11:11 PM

YEAH......what he said. lol

badassgrandam99

09-16-2002, 11:30 PM

Originally posted by Josh
Also the tails were wilth held to the general public due to the fact that *** was wanting to debut them @ SEMA this year.

I would say to you guys here and over @ GMPOWERTALK to all grow up! and act more mature.

...then maybe the tails just should've been held off until SEMA.... we've waited a long time already, what's a few more months... none of this would be a problem, but it was an *** member that leaked the pics out to the GA community... with that incident happening *** coulda just released copyrighted and dated pics so that no company could steal the design...

...and people are being fairly mature on this board... the only ones that are are the ones that start the name calling... see, i personally will not delete a thread in which there is a difference of opinion... people will work things out... both parties will make their case... but the minute name calling comes in, the moderator should first warn the member to watch their behavior...if it contiues then the moderator should delete that post...

..honestly... i just don't get why people are surprised with the price...

GrandAmSC/T

09-16-2002, 11:45 PM

least some of you are finally seeing what i was saying about ***'s business practices. They are discriminating against the NON *** owners just becasue we dont have 2 grand to spend on a body kit. I now Boycott *** and i will NEVER recommend them to anyone nor buy anything from them until they run a normal business for everyone.

I personally think its wrong, i dont care if you payed 2 grand for a body kit more power to ya. Other businesses dont either, they reward you a diffrent way. But they are biting the hands that feed them here. Most *** owners are now broke anyways after buying the body kit, looks like the demand for these clear tails is gonna last like a Snowball in HELL. Maybe someday they will come out of their cave and listen to us "LOWER CLASS" people that have not purchased anything from *** before. Until then **** on *** and their overpriced products.

PBergstr - i dont think grouch is bitching about the prices, i dont give a rats ass what it costs to design some freakin clear tails but it sure as hell doesnt cost any 500 bucks or anything close. YOu get your little price list that len "suppossedly" spent on making these tails and wipe your ass with it because thats about as much good as its worth.

just like Grouch said he said it like it is! *** doesnt give a rats ass about company feedback or anything all they care about is their repeat customers. Now Grouch if you were a previous *** customer they would have broke their ass to answer your questions. But since were all "lower class" people that dont want to spend our money on overpriced junk they ignore us. Grouch your post hit it right on the head, soo true.

By the time *** releases their Lights to the general public everybody will be so ****ed off that they wont buy them. I think in ***'s saving grace they need to start listening to the General Public's feedback instead they just do whatever the hell they want. I know if i had a business i sure as hell would be listening to people and seeing what they want!

Obviously they are doing something wrong if so many people are ****ed off and every board is bombarded with rude comments aimed at ***. instead of calling us childish why dont you open up your eyes.

AaronGTR

09-16-2002, 11:50 PM

I already ordered my tails from autosupermart back in april. Pre-ordered them for $241!:) APC is supposed to release them next month and they will look similar to the hot wheelz GA lights. As far as quality goes, a lot of people on here b*tch about APC, but I've had no problems yet with anything I've bought from them. I think *** sucks, because all their stuff is way overpriced, and they never release stuff or show any pictures when they say they will! I say screw ***!:rage:

SikMindz

09-16-2002, 11:52 PM

SC/T-

And while you're calling him childish you're calling me stupid now for buying an "overpriced piece of fiberglass"? Look who's talking Mr. Dealer Option Half SC/T Kit...where's your SC/T front, rear and sideskirts? Nice SC/T badges though... :confused:

I could care less if you bitch about *** as it's not my problem. But stop being so arrogant as to calling ALL *** owners dumb...

Edit: Don't think I didn't see that edit...

SpyhunteR

09-17-2002, 12:00 AM

this is just getting dumber and dumber... Than people will bash me for having a 2.4... Man o man.. What a day it is when peopel are getting bashed for just doing what they want. It's horrible.

on a side note I"M GOING TO SEMA! hehe... I live down the street from the convention center too. ;)

Screw all you haterz... Screw *** for not answering my emails... Screw all the people that don't listen to me! Screw all 3.4 owners!!

so how's that for bashing? I think i got everybody on that bash..

oh yeah and auto's are for bitches who're either too old or to much of a ***** **** to drive like a man..

there i'm done bashing randomly ...

close this thread it's just becoming pointless..

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 12:01 AM

Trust me id have it if it was out yet. Dont worry ill be buying it least its not overpriced like the *** kit.

And whether you'd like to admit it or not it is an overpriced piece of fiberglass, i could see spending 2 grand on a polyurethene kit but this ISNT. But if you want to spend that much on something that cracks then alright. :thumbs:

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 12:03 AM

Originally posted by SpyhunteR
Screw all you haterz... Screw *** for not answering my emails... Screw all the people that don't listen to me! Screw all 3.4 owners!!

so how's that for bashing? I think i got everybody on that bash..

LMAO lol

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 12:06 AM

Originally posted by SikMindz

Edit: Don't think I didn't see that edit...

yeah your right i edited it out becasue it came across wrong, im not here to **** off any *** owners im here to explain my dissatisfaction with them. I dont have any problems with the *** kits, they look good i admit that, your car looks good too. But i also admit they are overpriced for what little that you get.

SikMindz

09-17-2002, 12:09 AM

I never said it wasn't overpriced but that doesn't make me stupid for buying it. And between fiberglass and poly... Sure polyurethane is A LOT more flexible, but have you ever tried to fix something made of plastic after it broke? I'd take Bondo over that anyday of the week...

Anyways, I'm not here to argue with you so no hard feelings. So boys...go back to your "discussion" before the mods get a hold of this one! :thumbs:

badassgrandam99

09-17-2002, 12:14 AM

...see...now this is getting out of hand cuz we're just insulting each other over things that have NOTHING to do with the taillights... so let's just end it with the fact that there are some people that believe the lights to be overpriced and some that believe it to be worth the money... so that believe that *** has poor business practices and some that think they are great...

...everybody may never agree...but as long as you see where the other side is coming from....

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 12:34 AM

Originally posted by SikMindz
I never said it wasn't overpriced but that doesn't make me stupid for buying it. And between fiberglass and poly... Sure polyurethane is A LOT more flexible, but have you ever tried to fix something made of plastic after it broke? I'd take Bondo over that anyday of the week...

Anyways, I'm not here to argue with you so no hard feelings. So boys...go back to your "discussion" before the mods get a hold of this one! :thumbs:

I'm sorry I'm not here to argue with you or anyone for that matter. I hope you have no hard feelings towards me. The way that i had said that came across wrong. I had no intentions of offending you or calling you stupid for buying a body kit. Im sorry :(

SikMindz

09-17-2002, 12:38 AM

No prob. I apologize too for overreacting. Peace out...I'm done with this thread...:thumbs:

Grouch

09-17-2002, 12:43 AM

ahhh, yes. Once again after my post everything goes down the toilet. :(

*** was wanting to debut them @ SEMA this year

Why didn't *** just come out and say that and keep the pics to themselves. If they never posted them to their website none of this would have happened. Why did'nt *** just say that instead of going around secretly trying to remove any leaked photos. I am certain the N-Body community would have been more responsive to that.

I would say to you guys here and over @ GMPOWERTALK to all grow up! and act more mature

:rolleyes: Nice job. Just proved my point about the elitist-attitude of some of those around ***.

do you have any idea what it costs to develope, design and build molds/machines to produce a fiberglass (glass in itself is expensive) body kit?

A bit. But there is another fiberglass kit on the market for 1/2 the cost.

Also.. what are your questions!??

Doesn't matter anymore. There are still two threads at GMP with the questions and my email that is out there. Plus another thread at AleroMod with them. *** knows the questions, they have posted in those threads after I asked the questions. Don't know why they are ignoring them. And no they are not bash or flame ladded questions.

there is a difference between critqueing and slandering

Yes there is. And I don't believe I have slandered anyone. I am speaking on my experiences and dealings of *** and those around them.

Well in the time it took me to type this up yall have mellowed out. There is no need for personal attacks. That will get us no where. And before someone says it, I am not attacking ***, I am attempting to question some of their decisions and practices.

SikMindz

09-17-2002, 04:30 AM

It is now 2:30AM Cali time and I have just seen pics of the *** tails painted and installed. No I do not have pics to send you nor can I link you. However, IMO they are classy looking and for those of you that can afford them you are lucky people. For the rest of us...well, that's a whole other story. :thumbs:

peeps

09-17-2002, 06:32 AM

I personally, as the moderator of the General section, closed and moved the thread showing the picture of the *** lights a couple of days ago. Whether their rules are stupid or not, respect thier wishes. If they ask you not to post pictures of their stuff until it is fully released, be respectful of that.

GregFarz78

09-17-2002, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by GrandAmSC/T
Trust me id have it if it was out yet. Dont worry ill be buying it least its not overpriced like the *** kit.

And whether you'd like to admit it or not it is an overpriced piece of fiberglass, i could see spending 2 grand on a polyurethene kit but this ISNT. But if you want to spend that much on something that cracks then alright. :thumbs:

My thoughts exactly...fiberglass for body kits suck it gets chipped up and cracks easy...urethane on the other hand is much more durable.

I dont get what the big deal is about showing pics of the tails installed. I doubt GM will copy the design and be selling its customers tails that need to be painted and assembled :rolleyes:

Anyone that didnt see pics of the prototypes they're on my webshots page.

Cujo

09-17-2002, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by AaronGTR
I already ordered my tails from autosupermart back in april. Pre-ordered them for $241!:) APC is supposed to release them next month and they will look similar to the hot wheelz GA lights. As far as quality goes, a lot of people on here b*tch about APC, but I've had no problems yet with anything I've bought from them. I think *** sucks, because all their stuff is way overpriced, and they never release stuff or show any pictures when they say they will! I say screw ***!:rage:

Similiar to the Hot Wheels and only $241 USD !! Woohoo now we're talking :D That works out be roughly $500 or so CDN dollars cheaper ! Plus I don't have to get them painted and sealed :thumbs: Gee, I wonder who's gonna end up selling more taillights ??

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 12:24 PM

Originally posted by peeps
I personally, as the moderator of the General section, closed and moved the thread showing the picture of the *** lights a couple of days ago. Whether their rules are stupid or not, respect thier wishes. If they ask you not to post pictures of their stuff until it is fully released, be respectful of that.

Pictures can now be seen at AEDcentral.com. They have about 5 or so pics of a black GAGT with clear tails for anyone that wants 'legal' pictures to look at.

Rba007

09-17-2002, 02:58 PM

Those look good! But 500 Bucks? No way.

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 04:01 PM

For those of you wondering why myself and a few others question AEDs business practices, I'll give you an example why, IF this doesn't turn into a flame war...

http://www.clubgp.com/forum/topic.asp?whichpage=1&Forum_Title=Almost+anything+goes&Topic_Title=***+people+called+me+at+home+today%21&CAT_ID=6&FORUM_ID=6&TOPIC_ID=6416614

Third page gets interesting when *** starts making posts...

Any comments about this, please keep it mature. I don't want this thread locked and moved...

GregFarz78

09-17-2002, 04:15 PM

Originally posted by MidwestJosh
For those of you wondering why myself and a few others question AEDs business practices, I'll give you an example why, IF this doesn't turn into a flame war...

http://www.clubgp.com/forum/topic.asp?whichpage=1&Forum_Title=Almost+anything+goes&Topic_Title=***+people+called+me+at+home+today%21&CAT_ID=6&FORUM_ID=6&TOPIC_ID=6416614

Third page gets interesting when *** starts making posts...

Any comments about this, please keep it mature. I don't want this thread locked and moved...

LOL that was amusing...no comment

Rba007

09-17-2002, 04:29 PM

I remember all of that unfolding. They certainly lost a lot of business at clubgp! And, im sure its affecting folk here.

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 05:08 PM

http://www.aleromod.com/subdomains/forums/viewtopic.php?t=648

Apparently they aren't interested in making money either as you can see on page two...

I don't doubt the quality of *** products, it's their logic that I don't understand. Anyone have some pointers for me?

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 05:10 PM

LOL that clubgp thread was halarious. Good to see they hate *** as well.

Check out what the *** 'cronies' are posting on their board:
TEAM_***-01:02pm
Len Susana read this post. I say Fuk the 92-95 owners, well soem of em. I say you make Don teh only 95 PERIOD. Bunch of ingrates. http://www.gmpowertalk.com/forums/showthread.p src=smileys/puke.gif border=0 alt='pu1'>

Thats shows you right there they are only interested in their buddies, us other people they dont give a rats ass about.

TEAM_***-10:09am
Im on teh verge of being banned. WHo cares, GAGT.com sucks :vomit:

that explains it all right there.

well *** YOU SUCK.

Those are in no way worth 500 bucks after seeing them on the *** page. HELL NO.
I can wait till the APC ones come out, they are gonna look better than ***'s and be CHEAPER, and their gonna release to everybody not just APCS BEST CUSTOMERS. :vomit:

EVERYBODY SUPPORT APC AND SAY SCREW *** AND THEIR OVERPRICED S H I T.

P I S S on *** :rage:

badassgrandam99

09-17-2002, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by GregFarz78

LOL that was amusing...no comment

ditto :thumbs:

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by MidwestJosh
http://www.aleromod.com/subdomains/forums/viewtopic.php?t=648

Apparently they aren't interested in making money either as you can see on page two...

I don't doubt the quality of *** products, it's their logic that I don't understand. Anyone have some pointers for me?

LOL im just gonna sit back and laugh lol and watch this all unfold its only a matter of time before *** ****es EVERYBODY off and gets reported to the BBB. lol lol

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 05:24 PM

I know you are PO'd about the whole thing, but can we try and be a bit more civil?

AaronGTR

09-17-2002, 05:41 PM

*** is gonna end up like Ram Air Technologies. Out of business!lol :clap:

TA^Guy

09-17-2002, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by AaronGTR
*** is gonna end up like Ram Air Technologies. Out of business!lol :clap:
I agree.
After all I've read on various forums, not just from this post. And how they deal with their customers and potential customers there is no way in hell I'd buy a product from them.
And their top secert tail lights look like poo. Over a year of hype and it doesn't look any better than cleared GT lights. Wow, amazing.
For all those that like *** products, thats fine I have nothing against your choice. It's your ride, you do as you wish. But I've been around modding cars long enough to know that the way *** handle their company doesn't reflect quality.
I agree with alot of the ClubGP members these folks need to go take some classes at their local comunity college, maybe they would learn a thing or two.

Rba007

09-17-2002, 06:15 PM

It takes both high quality service, and a great product to run a succesful company. *** may make a quality product, but it seems (again, I have never dealt with them personally) that their service is lacking. I only hope that this changes, so our ga aftermarket will not take another hit!

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by AaronGTR
*** is gonna end up like Ram Air Technologies. Out of business!

LOL Aaron you crack me up! lol :clap:

:vomit: *** :vomit:

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 06:37 PM

well thats funny, because the majorty of people i know dont feel the same way a few of you guys on this forum do, but i'll tell you waht, if you dotn like the way they do buisness and dont like the way their products came out, DONT BUY THEM! It's that simple....

lightningGA

09-17-2002, 06:49 PM

Originally posted by PBergstr
well thats funny, because the majorty of people i know dont feel the same way a few of you guys on this forum do, but i'll tell you waht, if you dotn like the way they do buisness and dont like the way their products came out, DONT BUY THEM! It's that simple....

:wave:Hello....exactly!!!!!!!! :thumbs:

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 06:57 PM

Dont worry i wont be buying anything from them. Nor will i recommend anybody to them, ill just tell people how they are and what a ****ty business they are.

JAFO2RHh

09-17-2002, 07:15 PM

LOL and you guys say you're better then the GMpower members? Yea, this thread certainly proves that :rolleyes:

K, for all the people that think this kit is expensive. Try purchasing a Veilside kit, which is also, HAND CRAFTED, just like the *** kit is. Hell even Veilsides Honduh civic kit is over 2grand. Why, because of the time and craftsmanship involved in making the best kit on the market BAR NONE. *** is to GA's what Veilside is the the import tuner market, there is no reason for *** to lower their prices, *** SHOULDN'T lower their prices.

Josh

09-17-2002, 07:16 PM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh
LOL and you guys say you're better then the GMpower members? Yea, this thread certainly proves that :rolleyes:

You said it not me! But I agree!

Josh

09-17-2002, 07:21 PM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh

K, for all the people that think this kit is expensive. Try purchasing a Veilside kit, which is also, HAND CRAFTED, just like the *** kit is. Hell even Veilsides Honduh civic kit is over 2grand. Why, because of the time and craftsmanship involved in making the best kit on the market BAR NONE. *** is to GA's what Veilside is the the import tuner market, there is no reason for *** to lower their prices, *** SHOULDN'T lower their prices.

Well said!

JAFO2RHh

09-17-2002, 07:21 PM

Yes, Josh I did say it. Reading this thread is just like reading GMpower's threads about ***. Name calling, bashing....... Why? because they choose to take care of their previous customers first? Because they're kits are expensive? It doesn't make sense. As Len stated a while ago over at the other board, he doesn't care about the money.

Oh and for those of you that think *** will end up like RAT....... Fat chance, you actually think that they only make money building GM kits?? Not hardly...

Sorry, trying not to be a post whore, that's why both my posts have edits ;)

lightningGA

09-17-2002, 07:25 PM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh
LOL and you guys say you're better then the GMpower members? Yea, this thread certainly proves that :rolleyes:

K, for all the people that think this kit is expensive. Try purchasing a Veilside kit, which is also, HAND CRAFTED, just like the *** kit is. Hell even Veilsides Honduh civic kit is over 2grand. Why, because of the time and craftsmanship involved in making the best kit on the market BAR NONE. *** is to GA's what Veilside is the the import tuner market, there is no reason for *** to lower their prices, *** SHOULDN'T lower their prices.

:thumbs: and that's exactly it:thumbs:

Josh

09-17-2002, 07:27 PM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh
Yes, Josh I did say it. Reading this thread is just like reading GMpower's threads about ***. Name calling, bashing....... Why? because they choose to take care of their previous customers first? Because they're kits are expensive? It doesn't make sense. As Len stated a while ago over at the other board, he doesn't care about the money. .

Hell Len does not even own one of his Ram Air hoods because he put what money he has made in to profit right back into creating these tails. Most of you don't know it but *** employes about 15-20 workers to produce the kits for them! That takes money and time from the *** budget so Len and Susana do not make a whopping amount in profit as many of you think! This is the truth! If you don't believe me contact *** your self

webmaster@aedcentral.com
and the phone number (long distance) (760)639-1233 or )949)362-1048

Have a nice night~!

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 07:32 PM

CHRIS!! That was an awesome couple of posts dude! I'm so proud to have you as a co-founder in our club! hehe that was more than i could ever say adn you hit the nail right on the head

JAFO2RHh

09-17-2002, 07:53 PM

Ok, one more thing before I get off my soapbox, what would the members of gagt.com do in response to someone bashing, name calling, whining basically anything but constructive critism, against APOC, or PFYC? I've seem some hardcore defenders of both those companies on here................ Think about it........

badassgrandam99

09-17-2002, 07:56 PM

...and yet we all come on here and are still being childish... OK... the pics have been released... now can we just knock off the stupid petty crap... You like them...GOOD.... You don't like them... Fine... my god... oh...and let's not compare boards will ya... because the actual boards (grandamgt.com and gmpower) have nothing to do with this argument... it's certain individuals on the boards... so don't go attacking boards cuz i'm a member on both and i have my gripes about both!!! ...but i still frequent them cuz they are the two best places for me to learn about my car!!!

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:08 PM

well put!

lightningGA

09-17-2002, 08:17 PM

Originally posted by badassgrandam99
...and yet we all come on here and are still being childish... OK... the pics have been released... now can we just knock off the stupid petty crap... You like them...GOOD.... You don't like them... Fine... my god... oh...and let's not compare boards will ya... because the actual boards (grandamgt.com and gmpower) have nothing to do with this argument... it's certain individuals on the boards... so don't go attacking boards cuz i'm a member on both and i have my gripes about both!!! ...but i still frequent them cuz they are the two best places for me to learn about my car!!!

........and that's all that should matter to ALL of us!!!!!

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:26 PM

is it just me or did this board suddenly get quiter?? :D

Gator

09-17-2002, 08:39 PM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh
Ok, one more thing before I get off my soapbox, what would the members of gagt.com do in response to someone bashing, name calling, whining basically anything but constructive critism, against APOC, or PFYC? I've seem some hardcore defenders of both those companies on here................ Think about it........

Don't even use *** and PFYC in the same sentence!

Richard
"Gator"

Josh

09-17-2002, 08:41 PM

*** and PFYC are cool companies!

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:43 PM

Originally posted by Gator

Don't even use *** and PFYC in the same sentence!

Richard
"Gator"

um.. well Mr. "Gator" If you will look and read his post before responding... he didnt use *** and PFYC in the same sentance... dont mean to steal your attempt at glory.. but.. well... ther you have it.. :D

Josh

09-17-2002, 08:44 PM

Oh yeah *** and PFYC in the same sentence!

SikMindz

09-17-2002, 08:45 PM

OMG...would you all just drop it? Pics are out and posted as per the original intent of this thread- *** officially released them. Some of you don't like ***, fine. Some of you would die for ***, fine. Now get over it....:rolleyes:

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:46 PM

oh no! you didnt! aaaaaagggg!!!! *** and PFYC it the same sentance??? opps.. i did it too!! agg!! The only reason *** and PFYC should not be int he same sentance because PFYC dosent not deserve to be honored by being anywhere near ***... but thats just my opinion.. :D

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 08:47 PM

I've voiced my displeasure with APoC and I don't think they got deleted, nor was I flamed for it. Actually, quite a few people agreed with me.

I for one have not at any time said I though *** products where crap, etc. I think they way they do buisness is flat out silly. It is their company and they can do what they please, but RAT did the same thing. Look what happened to them. I'm not saying they will go out of buisness, but ya never know.

Josh

09-17-2002, 08:47 PM

Speaking of PFYC what is wrong with it? It has some kind of error the main page!

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 08:48 PM

Originally posted by PBergstr
The only reason *** and PFYC should not be int he same sentance because PFYC dosent not deserve to be honored by being anywhere near ***... but thats just my opinion.. :D

You have got to be kidding me... I did not just read that...

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:49 PM

meh, works for me, i was there earlier, lemme check again

Josh

09-17-2002, 08:50 PM

Originally posted by MidwestJosh

You have got to be kidding me... I did not just read that...

You did!

Gator

09-17-2002, 08:50 PM

Originally posted by PBergstr

um.. well Mr. "Gator" If you will look and read his post before responding... he didnt use *** and PFYC in the same sentance... dont mean to steal your attempt at glory.. but.. well... ther you have it.. :D sorry im just messin with ya

Well if you will look above that little picture by my name you will see the words "Moderator"...but...well...there you have it, I guess I am not here for "Glory!" :) Just messin with YOU!

My point was that you cannot compare the two companies in any sense other than that they both have names that start with letters from the alphabet! *** has time and time again offended members of numerous online communities with their sub-par business practices while PFYC has had perhaps a few minor misunderstandings that were quickly and easily resolved by their above the board service. These are facts and I am not intending to flame any supporter of ***. If you like/support them GREAT! Just don't get bent out of shape when other that do not express their opinions.

Richard
"Gator"

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:51 PM

yeah it still works for me...

Josh

09-17-2002, 08:52 PM

hmmm it does not work for me

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 08:53 PM

everybody sing along

drama drama dra MA...drama drama dra MA...

lol

Gator

09-17-2002, 08:56 PM

According to a post by Brian the PFYC site is being overhauled, you can see the old site at partsforyourcar.com but www.pfyc.com is down for the remodel I assume.

Richard
"Gator"

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 08:56 PM

Originally posted by Gator

Well if you will look above that little picture by my name you will see the words "Moderator"...but...well...there you have it, I guess I am not here for "Glory!" :) Just messin with YOU!

My point was that you cannot compare the two companies in any sense other than that they both have names that start with letters from the alphabet! *** has time and time again offended members of numerous online communities with their sub-par business practices while PFYC has had perhaps a few minor misunderstandings that were quickly and easily resolved by their above the board service. These are facts and I am not intending to flame any supporter of ***. If you like/support them GREAT! Just don't get bent out of shape when other that do not express their opinions.

Richard
"Gator"
yeah yeah well actually anyone who has worked with *** will attest to their bend-over-backwards service and excellent products, sure they may be alittle expensive but its like chris said earlier:
Its a hand crafted fiberglass effects kit, you cant expect it to cost you only 800 bucks, the veil kit for civic is well over 2000, this one, consdiering demand (only kit for ga) and quality.. (VERY EXCELLENT!) its a pretty good price! And so what if they like to reward thier loyal customers by giving them the first chance to buy lights.. its not like youve never seen that at anyother buisness!

~PhAt

Josh

09-17-2002, 08:57 PM

drama drama dra MA...drama drama dra MA...

Gator

09-17-2002, 09:01 PM

Originally posted by PBergstr

yeah yeah well actually anyone who has worked with *** will attest to their bend-over-backwards service and excellent products, sure they may be alittle expensive but its like chris said earlier:
Its a hand crafted fiberglass effects kit, you cant expect it to cost you only 800 bucks, the veil kit for civic is well over 2000, this one, consdiering demand (only kit for ga) and quality.. (VERY EXCELLENT!) its a pretty good price! And so what if they like to reward thier loyal customers by giving them the first chance to buy lights.. its not like youve never seen that at anyother buisness!

~PhAt

You have not yet nor will you hear me comment on the price of their kit. My issue (and many other's) is with the way they conduct business (behave online) I was one of the first people to fork out over $1000.00 for a RA hood from PFYC (I am willing to pay for quality, no doubt there) I just refuse to give my money to people who behave in the childish and unprofessional manner that I have seen both Len and Susana and numerous people they allowed to speak on their behalf. At least this current crop of supporters behave in a much more mature manner than some past folks! :) So far anyway!

Richard
"Gator"

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 09:02 PM

yeah yeah im sorry gusy....

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 09:07 PM

Originally posted by Gator

You have not yet nor will you hear me comment on the price of their kit. My issue (and many other's) is with the way they conduct business (behave online) I was one of the first people to fork out over $1000.00 for a RA hood from PFYC (I am willing to pay for quality, no doubt there) I just refuse to give my money to people who behave in the childish and unprofessional manner that I have seen both Len and Susana and numerous people they allowed to speak on their behalf. At least this current crop of supporters behave in a much more mature manner than some past folks! :) So far anyway!

Richard
"Gator"

Yeha i got out of hand.. it happens sometimes when people make no sense to me and complain about the "way they do buisness" Im not sayin you richard, you havent got me mad.. anyways i apologize! I dont mean to offend anyone :)

badassgrandam99

09-17-2002, 09:08 PM

and here i thought it was over... but now that the pics are out...some of you want to resort to name calling of other members... and you know who you are... i guess both sites have their fair share of immature members!!

JAFO2RHh

09-17-2002, 09:10 PM

Originally posted by Gator

You have not yet nor will you hear me comment on the price of their kit. My issue (and many other's) is with the way they conduct business (behave online) I was one of the first people to fork out over $1000.00 for a RA hood from PFYC (I am willing to pay for quality, no doubt there) I just refuse to give my money to people who behave in the childish and unprofessional manner that I have seen both Len and Susana and numerous people they allowed to speak on their behalf. At least this current crop of supporters behave in a much more mature manner than some past folks! :) So far anyway!

Richard
"Gator"

Well, we can't have that now can we, you @*)$) @)#() $@)#)( )@)($ *** #$*()*%) price *$(*) #)#)($%& @)(#$............. better? .....hehe ;):D

Oh and I'm not afraid of you, my dad could beat up your dad anyday......:boogie:

JAFO2RHh

09-17-2002, 09:12 PM

Originally posted by badassgrandam99
and here i thought it was over... but now that the pics are out...some of you want to resort to name calling of other members... and you know who you are... i guess both sites have their fair share of immature members!!

That's why my first post stated what it did. I'm a member of all 3 of the big GA Sites, they all have their ups and downs, but hey, it's all about the cars.

PBergstr

09-17-2002, 09:14 PM

well put chris, as always! :D

JAFO2RHh

09-17-2002, 09:15 PM

Originally posted by Josh
drama drama dra MA...drama drama dra MA...

Oh, go back to GMpower you nazimod ;)

Josh

09-17-2002, 09:19 PM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh

Oh, go back to GMpower you nazimod ;)

I will think about that!

TA^Guy

09-17-2002, 09:30 PM

Post whoring at its best :rolleyes:

Josh

09-17-2002, 09:32 PM

Yeah I have gained 8 posts today!

Gator

09-17-2002, 09:48 PM

Originally posted by TA^Guy
Post whoring at its best :rolleyes:

Amen John Amen! (oops is this a PW post??) :eek:

Richard
"Gator"

Josh

09-17-2002, 09:49 PM

This whole thread is a post whore thread.

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 09:55 PM

Originally posted by Josh
This whole thread is a post whore thread.

No... the 'Batman' thread, now that is PWing. lol

Josh

09-17-2002, 09:58 PM

What is this batman thread?

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 10:05 PM

http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2

It was quite long before the board crashed before as well. Kind of an inside thing for the GAP02.

GregFarz78

09-17-2002, 10:16 PM

Quite an amusing thread :huh:

peeps

09-17-2002, 10:21 PM

Originally posted by GregFarz78
Quite an amusing thread :huh: more like a f*cking pathetic thread. Who cares?

MidwestJosh

09-17-2002, 10:24 PM

I think now is a good time to get a MOD for this section. lol

badassgrandam99

09-17-2002, 11:20 PM

...great...so now we're gonna post whore in one thread about another postwhore thread... lol :boogie:

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 11:29 PM

Looks like *** called in the goofball troups to over take our board with their nonsense flaming members and postwhoring and such. You might try to stamp into our heads that *** is the best thing since sliced bread but ill tell you NO. Go back over to your own boards. :tool: :wave:

I think gator said it well here. It is about the price for me, i think its rediculous. But i would eventually fork over good money for something good quality. But i WILL NOT fork over good money for a good quality? product to such people with business practices like mentioned. And its not just me its every freakin grand am board complains to *** about the same issues. Maybe you guys need to wipe the cloudy crap off your eyes and see the light.

GrandAmSC/T

09-17-2002, 11:43 PM

ROTFLMAO bend-over backwards service to who? must be just the *** members. How come people try to e-mail *** with questions and why does it always seem that the non *** owners get ignored? But the rest of you *** cronies have each others phone numbers and play tiddly winks together. Yeah the kit is excellent till you hit something and it cracks,d a m n should of bought polyeurethene.

BTW i got this straight off of Veilsides website: High-grade fiberglass and carbon fiber allow for the lightweight construction desired in race vehicles while also providing the flexibility needed for daily driving

Maybe you should read again maybe thats the reason their kids are so expensive. Until *** does this they are a rip off.

You wanna know why other business's dont "Reward" their customers and like *** does. Because that is not ethically right. That only ****es people off, busineses reward people in diffrent ways like giving them discounts and the like. Maybe you need to take a business class along with your *** cronies and learn how a REAL business operates. Once again take off your hazy glasses and get out in the REAL WORLD not your imaginary *** world.

You can take your research and time *** bs and stick it where the sun dont shine thats about all its worth. I seen research on the GA body kit, now *** has the SAME yes thats right SAME freakin kit for the GRAND AM, GRAND PRIX, and ALERO, no i call that research baby, i call that lazyness or lack of immagination.

Im done with you guys. :wave:

JAFO2RHh

09-18-2002, 12:20 AM

Originally posted by GrandAmSC/T
Looks like *** called in the goofball troups to over take our board with their nonsense flaming members and postwhoring and such. You might try to stamp into our heads that *** is the best thing since sliced bread but ill tell you NO. Go back over to your own boards. :tool: :wave:

Ok, and who are you to tell people where they can post? You my friend need to get off your high horse before you fall

VTECSiGAH8R

09-18-2002, 12:32 AM

Originally posted by GrandAmSC/T
ROTFLMAO bend-over backwards service to who? must be just the *** members.

ya know, when I first saw bend over backwards, I naturally expected "and lubed me up for some penetration" to come afterwords lol Guess it was the opposite. But I believe the *** is also made of hand crafted fiberglass as someone else posted.

GrandAmSC/T

09-18-2002, 12:49 AM

Originally posted by VTECSiGAH8R

ya know, when I first saw bend over backwards, I naturally expected "and lubed me up for some penetration" to come afterwords lol Guess it was the opposite. But I believe the *** is also made of hand crafted fiberglass as someone else posted.

LOL thats too funny lol :clap:

GrandAmSC/T

09-18-2002, 12:50 AM

Originally posted by JAFO2RHh

Ok, and who are you to tell people where they can post? You my friend need to get off your high horse before you fall

Only if you knock me off :eek:

UNCTYPE-S

09-18-2002, 01:54 AM

it was mentioned on this thread that *** will see how the tails sell as far as *** owners grabbing them first. Well what happens if majority of the *** owners dont buy them. does that mean *** is gonna stop selling them cause the people with the kits dont want them. Once again, WHAT ABOUT THE NON *** OWNERS???? do we get screwed cause the tails might not sell as much as they think. if thats true, then i guess us non *** owners have to rely on the *** people to buy them.

GrandAmSC/T

09-18-2002, 02:11 AM

Originally posted by UNC0808
it was mentioned on this thread that *** will see how the tails sell as far as *** owners grabbing them first. Well what happens if majority of the *** owners dont buy them. does that mean *** is gonna stop selling them cause the people with the kits dont want them. Once again, WHAT ABOUT THE NON *** OWNERS???? do we get screwed cause the tails might not sell as much as they think. if thats true, then i guess us non *** owners have to rely on the *** people to buy them.

who cares boycott *** and just wait for the APC ones to come out ;) They will look better and be much cheaper. WHY spend 500 bucks on tail lights that arent even assembled and need to be painted?? thats the million dollar question here......

UNCTYPE-S

09-18-2002, 02:17 AM

well, like i said before, i dont own *** products, probably never will. I dont know *** personally but my opinion is that they are over priced. There, end of story for me. Im done, im not getting them, im not complaining. I will end on that note. *** lost a possible future customer. No hard feelings.

GrandAmSC/T

09-18-2002, 02:41 AM

Dang i was just thinking. Man i sure wish i knew about plastics. Im about to choose that as my major plastics technology. Then i can get some feedback from you guys and get some drawings and mass produce some freakin tail lights for the ga. I wouldn't be here to make money or rip anybody off id probably charge like 20 dollars extra for labor per tail, and rest of the cost would be the items used in making the tails themselves, Id be here for the GA family.
Of course id be doing it on the side and i'd could only probably produce like 5-10 a week but hell it would be alot better than *** 500 dollar taillights.

Dang just a dream........ back to reality. :mad:

embe

09-18-2002, 06:57 PM

I suppose I'll add to this nonsense...Anybody that appreciates the work involved in R&D and especially working with fibreglas (in this capacity) will understand why somethings are more expensive than others.

From a manufacturing perspective, batch quantities (production for cars like GA/Alero) are ALWAYS more expensive to produce than mass quantities (like for a Honda). At least there are some people out there willing to consider making these for our cars, and taking a risk by investing in a niche market like ours. We all know how many other kits OR tails are available for N-bodies.

With the attitudes like some that I've seen while reading through this thread, no wonder they limit the availability to previous buyers. The amount of work that goes into ***'s (or any similar batch production product) is obviously something a lot of people here don't understand. For example (not picking on you SC/T) if you PERSONALLY took the time to make your custom hood, and 80% of people told you it looked worse than your mom's ass, would you consider putting the hard work into making a custom hood for them? OR, would you rather make one for someone who said, "hey, good job". :thumbs:

I agree that the customer service aspect needs a bit of work, but that comes with experience....and I'm sure *** is aquiring a lot of experience after reading some of these posts.

As for people squawking about the assembly/painting...c'mon! You've never assembled or painted ANYTHING on your GA? Sure the price is a premium, so if you can't afford it don't complain about it. If that were the case, everyone driving a GA would complain about how over-priced Mercedes are.

In conclusion, until one of you (people griping about the price) come out with your OWN set of tails that are more AFFORDABLE and as good of quality as ***'s, please quit the smear campaign.

:wave:

I am in no-way affiliated with anyone (except my wife) :cool:

PBergstr

09-18-2002, 08:03 PM

Originally posted by GrandAmSC/T
Dang i was just thinking. Man i sure wish i knew about plastics. Im about to choose that as my major plastics technology. Then i can get some feedback from you guys and get some drawings and mass produce some freakin tail lights for the ga. I wouldn't be here to make money or rip anybody off id probably charge like 20 dollars extra for labor per tail, and rest of the cost would be the items used in making the tails themselves, Id be here for the GA family.
Of course id be doing it on the side and i'd could only probably produce like 5-10 a week

Woah.. thas funny.. cause thats what len does...!! Except he doesnt mass produce, mass production cuts down on quality! Each one is made with the upmost quality... such is the *** tradition! :)

badassgrandam99

09-18-2002, 08:25 PM

IT JUST NEVER STOPS DOES IT?? ...read embe's post... let's end this stupid debate already....

jaketuff

09-18-2002, 11:50 PM

Originally posted by MidwestJosh
I've voiced my displeasure with APoC and I don't think they got deleted, nor was I flamed for it. Actually, quite a few people agreed with me.

I for one have not at any time said I though *** products where crap, etc. I think they way they do buisness is flat out silly. It is their company and they can do what they please, but RAT did the same thing. Look what happened to them. I'm not saying they will go out of buisness, but ya never know.

Yeah, at least John/Aleroboy stepped up and took the heat and then told us why there were problems, and that it was beyond his control....

*** has been around for a while, and it is a Mom and Pop type vendor, but they have spoken very poorly for themselves in several cases here on the net, the cheapest marketing they have... It is already a bad experience before the parts even are thought about being bought....

GAOwnershttp://www.soccercrew.com/forum/Smilies/97.gifAED ... Don't need an Masters in Marketing to figure that sho ain't good for ***!

JOUT

PBergstr

09-19-2002, 02:18 PM

eh who cares, *** rocks, they have awesome products, and who cares if we stand up for them?? very rarely will *** actually come on and mess with you guys, we do it for them because we like them so much!

AaronGTR

09-19-2002, 06:11 PM

They don't come here 'cause they know they can't win a fight if it's not on their board, and no one wants their CRAP! Try going over to their board and posting an opinion that makes them look bad. You'll see what I mean. *** sucks monkey b**ls!:p

MidwestJosh

09-19-2002, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by AaronGTR
*** sucks monkey b**ls!:p

And this is what gets threads locked (not meant to be personal). Just when you think this thread was gonna die down... lol

No comments from me...

AaronGTR

09-19-2002, 06:23 PM

Your right. It was probably out of order. I can't help myself though. After seeing the way they've treated people here and in other pontiac forums I really dislike these people, and it makes me sick when people stand up for them. I won't say anything more on this subject.

UNCTYPE-S

09-19-2002, 07:22 PM

Not to get the party started again, but you can say what you want anytime, as long as its to a point. Yeah maybe our word is getting us nowhere, but at least we are sticking up for what we believe in whats right or whats wrong. OPINIONS!!!!!

Tek

09-19-2002, 09:56 PM

To those who argued about the SC/t and the *** kit, im osrry to say the SC/T kit looks like ass.....

it looks like u rear ended a ricer and his wing got caught in your bumper....

SilverGT1

09-19-2002, 10:31 PM

Originally posted by Tek
To those who argued about the SC/t and the *** kit, im osrry to say the SC/T kit looks like ass.....

it looks like u rear ended a ricer and his wing got caught in your bumper....

to each thier own. but I think your in the minority :D

GrandAmSC/T

09-19-2002, 10:49 PM

Originally posted by Tek
To those who argued about the SC/t and the *** kit, im osrry to say the SC/T kit looks like ass.....

it looks like u rear ended a ricer and his wing got caught in your bumper....

So why dont you go buy the *** and shut up!
http://pages.prodigy.net/bestsmileys1/emoticons2/shutup.gif

Rayc3r X

09-19-2002, 10:51 PM

Just to let ya know , the lights will be available to everyone december 1st , for those who care , I do , I dont own a damn *** thing for my car , but I think those lights are f-ckin cool , I have the money so I dont care about the price, if that makes it less likely to see them on every grand am then oh well. sometimes ya gotta pay to be different and this is no exception, just my .02 , dont wanna be flamed here guys :thumbs:

jakhammer

09-20-2002, 01:07 AM

hmmm, im all about getting kewl shiz for my car, but I do draw a line. Clear tails are on my list as a must have. I like the way the *** tails look. Dont like the fact that I have to assemble them (lets see TOG sell headers you have to assemble, yeah right), dont like that I have to paint them.

Would I buy them, yes, if they didnt come with a price tag of 2 arms, one leg, and my left testicle.

Hello, Grand Ams dont sell for $35,000+, why do manufactures price the mods as though they do cost that much? Its not like they are imported from japan! lol

I guess its APC or bust now.

jakhammer

GrandAmSC/T

09-20-2002, 03:12 AM

i dont know i think its just me, but i really dont think the *** tails look any better than my stocker clear tail lights. I cleared my factories and put LED bulbs in there. Only diffrence is their led bulbs are a tad bit bigger (So what) and they dont have a chrome reflector like mine. well when i get all LED's in the back ill be painting my reflector black. All i need is 4 amber turn signal led's and a 2 white reverese light LED's and ill have my own cheaper version of ***. :thumbs:

PBergstr

09-20-2002, 11:06 PM

yeah except ***'s has halogen back-up lights, and about 30 LED's per light... ALSO!! for the turn signal the rows sequence in to out.. how cool is that???

PhAt

PBergstr

09-20-2002, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by UNC0808
it was mentioned on this thread that *** will see how the tails sell as far as *** owners grabbing them first. Well what happens if majority of the *** owners dont buy them. does that mean *** is gonna stop selling them cause the people with the kits dont want them. Once again, WHAT ABOUT THE NON *** OWNERS???? do we get screwed cause the tails might not sell as much as they think. if thats true, then i guess us non *** owners have to rely on the *** people to buy them.

Okay whoever said that was a liar.. lol the only reason we (owners) get them first, is because Len is thanking us for our support, and whats us to have something cool for ourselves, if only for a month.. by december they WILL be up for public sale.. whether owners buy them or not! And believe me, almost every owner i know has ordered them or is saving up for them

PBergstr

09-20-2002, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by jakhammer
hmmm, im all about getting kewl shiz for my car, but I do draw a line. Clear tails are on my list as a must have. I like the way the *** tails look. Dont like the fact that I have to assemble them (lets see TOG sell headers you have to assemble, yeah right), dont like that I have to paint them.

Would I buy them, yes, if they didnt come with a price tag of 2 arms, one leg, and my left testicle.

Hello, Grand Ams dont sell for $35,000+, why do manufactures price the mods as though they do cost that much? Its not like they are imported from japan! lol

I guess its APC or bust now.

jakhammer

Okay "jackhammer" Its not like its that complicated to assemble them!!! Also, you dont "have" to paint them, im not, they come with a black plastic body that does not look too bad on your cars, i mean sure it might look better painted, depends on the color of your car.. but i wont look too bad on mine so screw it.. Also.. these tails are of extremly good quality, len busted his @$$ trying to find high quality parts that dont cost that much.. Believe it or not, tails cost a little more than 50 bucks to make, in fact its dayam near 500 to make two of them.. We are getting an awesome deal on these and Len is really hookin us up! if you think about it he could charge almost whatever he wanted, but he dosent, he gives them to us for almost at cost! I think thats pretty freakin awesome and i thank him ever chance i get!

~PhAT

UNCTYPE-S

09-21-2002, 02:20 AM

pbergstr-
i can carless anymore about this whole thread but i have one question. How are we suppose to believe you that we can get them for cost, which is 500. So that means, hes giving us a deal, so the tails in actuality are over 500. LOL. I just cant see any aftermarket tailights being over 500. JMO.

GrandAmSC/T

09-21-2002, 04:30 AM

Originally posted by UNC0808
pbergstr-
i can carless anymore about this whole thread but i have one question. How are we suppose to believe you that we can get them for cost, which is 500. So that means, hes giving us a deal, so the tails in actuality are over 500. LOL. I just cant see any aftermarket tailights being over 500. JMO.

i dont know but im with him on this one. I dont see any way in hell that these lights could have costed nearly 500 to make. Im assuming the biggest cost was the LED's. ok lets see here i did some pricing last night on round LED clusters and i rarely seen any for over 100 bucks a pair. even if len used 100 dollar led cluster pairs in each tail that adds up to 200 bucks. - for that matter hell ill give him 300 bucks for the LEDS thats outrageous already, you cant tell me that there is 300 bucks or even 200 bucks worth of plastic and 2 halogen bulbs there :rolleyes: but whatever you say genius.

PBergstr

09-21-2002, 09:38 AM

haha okay sc/t lets look at this closer...there are two clusters in each tail.. 200 bucks is PER TAIL.. x2=400bucks for LEDS, then you tack on the halogen blubs, plastic, labor, ect.. and you see how cool Len really is bein about all of this.. He's helpin us out dude.

badassgrandam99

09-21-2002, 10:24 AM

...this thread honestly needs to be dropped... how many times do we have to argue over the same damn points...

IF YOU THINK THAT THESE LIGHTS ARE WORTH THE MONEY....CONGRATULATIONS...GO BUY THEM!!!!!

IF YOU THINK THAT THESE LIGHTS ARE TOO EXPENSIVE... THEN DON'T ****IN BUY THEM!!!!!

END OF STORY!!! I DON'T CARE ABOUT ANYONE ELSES OPINION ANYMORE!!!! :mad: :mad:

...i still like all of you... just a little ticked :D

lightningGA

09-21-2002, 01:22 PM

Originally posted by badassgrandam99
...this thread honestly needs to be dropped... how many times do we have to argue over the same damn points...

IF YOU THINK THAT THESE LIGHTS ARE WORTH THE MONEY....CONGRATULATIONS...GO BUY THEM!!!!!

IF YOU THINK THAT THESE LIGHTS ARE TOO EXPENSIVE... THEN DON'T ****IN BUY THEM!!!!!

END OF STORY!!! I DON'T CARE ABOUT ANYONE ELSES OPINION ANYMORE!!!! :mad: :mad:

...i still like all of you... just a little ticked :D

I agree, we all need to just agree to disagree on this one.

UNCTYPE-S

09-21-2002, 03:06 PM

correct me if im wrong but this and many other websites, we come on here and talk about likes and dislikes, opinions, stuff like that. if people came on here and posted a thread saying "im gonna get these tailights" WHAT IS THE POINT. Then nobody would have anything to discuss. Let people discuss their feelings and when the thread is over the thread is over. If you dont like all of the bitching going on in this thread then dont click on it, simple as that. while people are telling people to shut up about this thread, well why dont you do yourself a favor that would not be stressful on your likfe and just ignore it. This is not at anyone specifically, but my point is that this was just a fact/answer website, it would be boring. let people opinionate.

jakhammer

09-21-2002, 08:42 PM

easy to assemble or not, i need both my legs, both my arms, if its possible, I would like to keep both of my testicles too. I guess I could always auction off a kidney on ebay.

if he has $500 into materials fine. I can not disprove that. I didnt pay $30,000+ for my grand am, but I did pay over $30k for my F-150. Guess what, I can get clear tails for that for well under $200. I dont want tails for my truck, but the point is why would I pay 3-4 times the amount for a set of clear tails for a car that cost $10,000 less?

My opinion is simply this, $500 is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaay more than I will ever pay for clear tails. Thats in the price range of Dual Magnaflows installed. Does this bring things into perspective for anyone?

jakhammer

GrandAmSC/T

09-22-2002, 06:07 AM

I dont even think clear tail lights for my moms bmw cost 500 bucks :rolleyes:

But really if this huge argument/ converstion WHATEVER you wanna call it is stressing you out or your loosing sleep over it maybe you should just put yourself out of misery right now. Im sure theres alot more stressful things in life than this stupid thread.

Or better yet were all gonna have our opinions and im sure most people are gonna voice them no matter what, whether you wanna hear it or not. So if you dont wanna hear the BS then dont click on the thread and we will all be happy campers. Theres diehard people here that will argue till the sun dont shine on this issue and theres people like me that get a chuckle out of it, you get those people together and that can make a lengthy argument. :nono:

badassgrandam99

09-22-2002, 12:31 PM

i come back cuz i like a good debate...HOWEVER... the debate in this thread has not progressed... it's the same points being made over and over again... i'm definitely not losing sleep over it... it just gets retared when everybody is saying the same thing repeatedly... just my opinion though

TA^Guy

09-22-2002, 03:53 PM

jakhammer I agree.
I don't care what it's made of or how.
A) it's not worth 5 bills.
B) there isn't $400 in materials used, and if there is that is probbally one reason why they aren't successful selling this crap.

Awhile ago before the forum went down I made a post about the automotive aftermarket. Years back you knew what companys to give your money to, and what you'll get in return. Now days since modding your car has become ever so trendy, these people are just out there to make a dollar. Thats where we get crappy aftermarket companys like APC, and scam artist on ebay.
I could go on forever about this, but roots of hot rodding there was no 'aftermarket'. There were replacement parts at best. This is when being creative and using skills was important, not how much money you can spend on over priced junk and just slap it together.

Dr_Kyle

09-22-2002, 04:36 PM

Originally posted by TA^Guy
jakhammer I agree.
I don't care what it's made of or how.
A) it's not worth 5 bills.
B) there isn't $400 in materials used, and if there is that is probbally one reason why they aren't successful selling this crap.

Awhile ago before the forum went down I made a post about the automotive aftermarket. Years back you knew what companys to give your money to, and what you'll get in return. Now days since modding your car has become ever so trendy, these people are just out there to make a dollar. Thats where we get crappy aftermarket companys like APC, and scam artist on ebay.

That's the best arguement I've seen yet and I agree 100%. I remember the post too and it's really too bad that a majority of the aftermarket industry is dominated by cheap products and scam artists. Quality or not, no set of tail lights is worth $500 to me.

Also, on the technical side, there is no way 2 pairs of LED clusters cost $100 each. LED's aren't that expensive, period.

I do agree that every owner should do as they please, though. If you are wi