And he dared knock American

[Licit]

I was arguing with a buddy who thinks anything import MUST be better. I feel I have a point though. What i said was to compare an '02 Ferrari 575M Maranell F1 with an '03 Ford SVT Mustang Cobra. I'm only comparing 1/4 mile times and price but it is funny when you look at it. The Ferrari is $247,706 and runs a 12.6 in the 1/4, the SVT Mustang is $34,750 and runs a 12.9 in the 1/4. So for a 1/3 of a second in the 1/4 I can have the Mustang and buy a house for $200,000+. I know there is the fact of the name Ferrari and it's only straight line speed, and there is the suspension and sound and a TON of differences but when broken down like I did he had to agree a little. I am really hoping to own an SVT as long as my GAGT lasts a couple years more to save up, and his sister has a Ferrari so that's why I picked those 2 cars to compare. Anyone else think the '03 SVT Mustang Cobra is one bad piece of machinery? I think it's one of the refreshing examples of modern American muscle. I just can't imagine running 12's in the 1/4, I only hope that dream comes to be.

[2002GT]

I totally agree with you... but there would be nothing else like saying you own a ferrari, but i see where u are coming from

[Bailey Man]

MMMNnnnnnn..... 03 Cobra!!!! :)

[Lash]

The Girlies like the Ferrari's better. If your in a "dry spell", you can't loose with one of them. :D

[1993Grandamgt]

oh by far the COBRA is the KING of the pony cars.... look at the difference between a cobra and a new Z06. Not much of a difference and you save a decent amount of cash to mod it up even more, and you can carry 2 additional people in the cobra!

[95-GT]

400+ Ponies out of the factory for $32,000 is awsome. For a grand in mods, you can push over 500 RWHP out of this beast.

[1993Grandamgt]

its 390 Hp from the factory... but close enuff. although you bring it home and remove the air silencer from the stock airbox and you have just a hair over 400 HP. but yes for the price of a set of headers, cat x-pipe, and a catback. you will have around 480 hp. to get to 500 hp you will need an aftermarket blower pulley then you will be at 500 HP. or you can go radical and just say the hell with the Eaton blower and yank it and put on the Kenne Belle Twin screw supercharger and push out, well you read it for yourself:

http://kennebell.net/superchargers/ford/cobra03/cobra03.htm

[95-GT]

Actually, the 390 is a downrated power rating from SVT. They did it for a few reasons.

1) The 99 Cobra and their problems with the power rating.
2) Insurance Reasons.
3) Classification reasons.

The stock motor produces about 407-415 horsepower out of the factory. But I think you would be better off spending the $3,000 on parts for the stock cobra then a brand new s/c itself.

[1993Grandamgt]

i will tell you what... that supercharger is worth every penny they ask for it. i had it on my lightning, and the thing was awesome, especially with my other mods i had done to it. this may well be my next car i buy, afterall i sold the lightning and have money left over.

[95-GT]

The Lightning is a bad ass truck. What yr was urs?

[1993Grandamgt]

2003

[Panacea]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
oh by far the COBRA is the KING of the pony cars.... look at the difference between a cobra and a new Z06. Not much of a difference and you save a decent amount of cash to mod it up even more, and you can carry 2 additional people in the cobra!

Too bad the Corvette will spank it's ass in the twisties, and when coming out of them!

Oh, and the Rustang Cobra won't be close to the Vette come 2006. :woowoo

[1993Grandamgt]

are you smoking crack Panacea? a 1/10 in the 1/4 behind the z06. and not much slower in the twisties and a topspeed thats very close to eachother... for what you save by buying the cobra you can afford to whoop the Z06's A$$!

[1993Grandamgt]

but of course another case of comparing apples with oranges... why dont you compare the Ford GT to the 2006 Vette. can you say annihilation? 500+ hp from just the small motor... next year the real motor comes a wicked 5.4 supercharged!

[Panacea]

Well, I guess I'd take the $54,000 Z06 over the $100,000 GT. The funny thing is, the Z06 will have 500+ HP in 2006.

Sorry, I'd be embarrased riding in a Rustang. Too many Moms, Grandma's and Daughters riding around in them. At least I have prestige when driving a Vette. Plus you don't see nearly as many on the road as the rustangs.

Oh, and if you wanted to talk apples to apples, I'll take a Lingenfelter Supercharged (550-600hp, $100,000 price range) and smoke the GT :thumbs:

[iceman]

Originally posted by Panacea

Sorry, I'd be embarrased riding in a Rustang. Too many Moms, Grandma's and Daughters riding around in them.


Been checking out the general age/gender of GA drivers on the road lately ???

[1993Grandamgt]

Originally posted by Panacea
Well, I guess I'd take the $54,000 Z06 over the $100,000 GT. The funny thing is, the Z06 will have 500+ HP in 2006.

Sorry, I'd be embarrased riding in a Rustang. Too many Moms, Grandma's and Daughters riding around in them. At least I have prestige when driving a Vette. Plus you don't see nearly as many on the road as the rustangs.

Oh, and if you wanted to talk apples to apples, I'll take a Lingenfelter Supercharged (550-600hp, $100,000 price range) and smoke the GT :thumbs:

PRESTIGE????? my wifes 22 yr old cousin has a new black Z06 and my best friend growing up, who is 24, has a blue Z06.. what prestige. plus everywhere i go i see grandpa's and grandmas and women driving vette's.... trust me they are nothing special. have you personally drove in a Z06 or any new vette? the ride sux, they arent all that fast, and theinterior is ugly... by the way most mustangs on the road that are women driven are 6 cyls. as a matter of fact most mustang sales in the us are 6 cyl. (something like 68%) but as was also stated about the fact that grandmas and moms and daughters are driving mustangs... look at the GrandAm, my wife (also a mother) has one...... gee did you ever think about that when you bought your grandam? as for the lingenfelter... is that the best you can come up with to beat the GT? my dads porsche would wipe the floor with both the lingenfelter and the GT! then there is the almighty Saleen S7! the list goes on. But dollar for dollar the cobra is better than the Z06 and is only a few ticks behind it in performance..

[95-GT]

lol Panacea.....2005 Cobra is slated to get the 5.4 S/C with 500+ HP and 550 Torque also....Imagine slapping a pulley on that sucker! The 2005 GT is supposed to get the 4.6 S/C with about 400 HP.

[Licit]

I have to agree with Panacea about the Cobra coming out of turns, or at least Car and Driver did. From their take the tranny in the Cobra doesn't come out of turns well nor does the suspension ride through turns like a Z06. On the other hand I agree that the SVT Cobra is a world apart from any other Mustang(3.8 V6, GT, or even the Mach1). Of the 2 guys in town here that have Cobras they both know how to drive'em. I haven't seen anyone that is wasting space in a Cobra here. Now in all the other much LESSER Mustangs there are plenty of chics and grandmas getting to admire my GAGT's tail lights.:D Also thank goodness they are beefing up the Stang GT's for '05. Are they going to look like the preview pics in Car/Driver where the front end gets some retro styling? I test drove a '00 Stang GT and couldn't wait to get back in my GAGT, seriously.

[95-GT]

hmm...my buddies stock GT 5-speed ran a 13.9. He now runs a 13.4 with some bolt ons....you thinik your grand am will be showing them ur tail lights?

[Panacea]

Seth - That's what our car is supposed to be made for...

1993 - What would you consider new? '94 is the latest model year I've driven. What do you mean the ride is horrible? Are you talking about having such a bumpy ride? If you are, then well... you've obviously never been in a real sports car.

Licit - Did you see the video with all the cars doing the road test? The Corvette, along with a handful of others were only able to take the turn. Even the McLaren lost control...

[Panacea]

1993 - Again, I did not buy my car for the intent of going fast. Nor am I ashamed or in disbelief that the Grand Am is nothing more than a family car.

As for your Lingenfelter Statement... Are you that naive about the performance of a Lingenfelter?

Just for Sh!t's 'N Giggles

http://www.fast-autos.com/lingenfeltercenter.htm#lpe500tt
http://www.fast-autos.net/lingenfelter/lingenfelter650tt.html

Oh, and BTW, the Ford GT is expected to be in the $100-150,000 price range :)

[95-GT]

lollollollollol Where do you get this wild price from? Dude, my dad is a 32 year ford employee. He worked with SVT for a few years. He now does ALL the rearend gears for all ford and their partner companies...thats how my brother got his 3.73 gear for free from the factory.

[Panacea]

http://www.rsportscars.com/eng/cars/ford_gt.asp

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests...12_0303_fut_gt/

http://www.nctd.com/printversion-sneak.cfm?ReviewID=24

http://www.motorcities.com/contents/02JEA052763135.html

Do you need any more links? I didn't sat it was definate and WTF does your dad working for Ford and making Ass parts have to do with anything? wtf ???

Note: With the stupid Motor Trend link, you'll have to actually click on "Road Tests" Then click on the "Coupes" link and then search for the 2003 Ford GT link..

[Panacea]

"The specs suggests 0-60 runs in four seconds--a tick quicker than the Dodge Viper, which is probably the quickest off-the-shelf production car currently sold in the U.S. With the GT, Ford will finally have a car that the automotive world views in league with the Dodge Viper and Chevrolet Corvette Z06, not to mention Porsches or Ferraris "

Dunno about you but for $100,000-150,000 you're getting a pretty slow car... The Z06 does 0-60 in 4 seconds already, and if you wanted to get the Lingenfelter 650 Twin-Turbo, you'd be spending $113,000 and run 0-60 in 3.3 seconds... Pretty sad if you ask me.

If I had the choice, I'd pick the Ferrari or Porsche before I got the GT... Actually, no I wouldn't. I'd just spend the $113k for the 650TT or get the $165k 427 TT Lingenfelter. Can't really beat 0-60 in 1.9 seconds :thumbs:

[95-GT]

ok, FYI, thats the GT40....not the GT. There is a BIG differance. So please, next time make sure you know what your looking at before you post it. And how does m dad make ass parts? Ford has the fastest production car for $30k or less on the market right now...what does GM have to offer that can beat that?

[GTManiac]

Originally posted by Panacea
Well, I guess I'd take the $54,000 Z06 over the $100,000 GT. The funny thing is, the Z06 will have 500+ HP in 2006.

Sorry, I'd be embarrased riding in a Rustang. Too many Moms, Grandma's and Daughters riding around in them. At least I have prestige when driving a Vette. Plus you don't see nearly as many on the road as the rustangs.

Oh, and if you wanted to talk apples to apples, I'll take a Lingenfelter Supercharged (550-600hp, $100,000 price range) and smoke the GT :thumbs:

are YOU on CRACK??? :confused: :confused:

MORE women drive the GA than men. It's a FACT that was recently published by a GM survey. I can not believe that you're trying to diss a mustang for the sole fact that (supposedly) more women drive it. HOW sexist is that?

Close-mindedness and arrogance, man and that's ALL you ever post with.

[Panacea]

GT, first off why are you back? You said you were leaving and never coming back...

Next, the Rustang is supposed to be a muscle car. It's made for car enthusiasts, not GUYs or GIRLs who want to go get groceries or go to the mall in!!!

It's supposed to be an enthusiasts car, but anymore people buy rustangs as if they were buying a Grand Am, Cavalier, Civic, Saturn, etc.

If you would have read all my posts you would have seen that I said I KNOW that my car is a FAMILY CAR... My car is not supposed to be a muscle car... My car is geared at all age groups and both genders. If I wanted a muscle car or sports car I would have gotten one.

If a woman car enthusiast wants a Mustang becaue it's a MUSTANG then fine, same with a guy. But when someone buys the car because it looks "cute" or because they think they'll be "cool" because they own one is just wrong. Those are the people who let the car go to hell and look like ass!

Also, "Dissing the mustang for the sole fact that (supposedly) more women drive it" I can and will diss it becasue it's a free country. The sole fact that the car is considered "Cute" and everyone wants one for a grocery getter has made the Mustangs image look bad.

Whatever, call me sexist, arrogant, and close-minded all you want. Not going to hurt my feelings, and not going to change my mind. Quite frankly you're wrong, and if you knew me you'd know otherwise...

Now, do like you said you were going to do 6 months ago and leave.

[Panacea]

Originally posted by 95-GT
ok, FYI, thats the GT40....not the GT. There is a BIG differance. So please, next time make sure you know what your looking at before you post it. And how does m dad make ass parts? Ford has the fastest production car for $30k or less on the market right now...what does GM have to offer that can beat that?

You said your dad makes "Rearend gears" So, I reffered to those as ASS parts...

Please Explain to me what the difference between the GT and the GT40 is?

I'm not talking about the Mustang GT... I'm talking about the GT40 or Ford GT whatever the f'k it's called. As far as I can tell they're one in the same, or so that's what it looked like.

Yes, the Mustang is the fastest $30k car... for now.

Oh well, I'm done with this thread. Besides what do you Fod guys expect coming to a GM board :rolleyes:

[GTManiac]

WHO are you to say that someone can't buy a car based upon the fact that it'sa muscle car. SO WHAT? What if a person who can't work on cars (even if their life depended on it, they're THAT bad) They shouldn't have the privilege or the pleasure of driving a car that they would like.

6 months ago I said I was taking a leave of absence. I'm currently still on that leave as @$$hats such as yourself still flock to this site with your @$$anine comments that include little to no thought. Someone doesn't like your SUPERIOR :rolleyes: opinion so they should leave?

How 'bout this:

I ----> give you the finger:

................./´¯/)
..............,/¯../
............./..../
......./´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
..../'/.../..../......./¨¯\
..('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
...\.................'...../
....\.................._.·´
......\..............(
........\.............\
.........\.............\
..........\.............\

And you ---> go back to your sexist remarks, closed minded thoughts and opinions.

[Panacea]

One last thing... Grow up.

Thanks for not knowing what I mean, and thanks for throwing all my remarks out of context. Next time, don't assume you know what I mean.

People can buy a Corvette or Mustang all they want, more power to them. But I feel the only people who should buy them are those who can respect the car for what it is. They can leave it bone stock for all I care, but for Gods sake don't buy it because you think it's "Cute"

And with that I say goodnight. GT, might want to consider growing up a little bit and stop assuming you know what people mean, cause quite frankly, you don't.

[95-GT]

The GT is the regular mid-grade edition of the mustang line, the GT40 is a remake of the GT40's that were made back in the 60's or 70's I believe it was.The GT40 is going to be a limited edition production car, kind of like the 2000 Cobra R was.

"Next, the Rustang is supposed to be a muscle car. It's made for car enthusiasts, not GUYs or GIRLs who want to go get groceries or go to the mall in!!!"

Out here, I see lots of "bitches" who drive corvettes around and think they are bad ass in them. Well I love it when I am in my brothers or my buddies stang and I shut them right down into the ground. I also see lots of FAGGOT driving corvettes who are always looking aroound to see if other people are checking him and his car out, thinking he is cool or some ****. Atleast people who drive mustangs doint have to look for attention, as their $20k less car will smoke the **** out of this homos Z06.

"Whatever, call me sexist, arrogant, and close-minded all you want. Not going to hurt my feelings, and not going to change my mind. Quite frankly you're wrong, and if you knew me you'd know otherwise..."

So were wrong for stating that the $32,000 SVt Cobra is faster then a Z06 for much less money? For that extra $20,000 you save, just imagine all the suspension and engine modifications you can do. Can you say 10 second car that handles 10 times better?

But I'd like to see the day that a GM car will beat the mustangs....especially with the information I know about them. Peace out dude

[GTManiac]

Originally posted by Panacea
One last thing... Grow up.

Thanks for not knowing what I mean, and thanks for throwing all my remarks out of context. Next time, don't assume you know what I mean.

People can buy a Corvette or Mustang all they want, more power to them. But I feel the only people who should buy them are those who can respect the car for what it is. They can leave it bone stock for all I care, but for Gods sake don't buy it because you think it's "Cute"

And with that I say goodnight. GT, might want to consider growing up a little bit and stop assuming you know what people mean, cause quite frankly, you don't.

EXACTLY what I said. You think that the car's ownership should be dictated by the fact that of what the car is, not who likes/wants it. That's a STEREOTYPE, plain and simple. Reword everything to your utmost desire and you're STILL saying the same thing.

Explain why you bought your GA. JUSTIFY to me that you bought a family car for family reasons. See how STUPID that sounds?

[1993Grandamgt]

95_GT the GT40 is not going to be called that, they changed to just plain Ford GT.

Panacea.... Why are you being a ****? the cobra stock does a 0-60 in 4.1secs. and as for the viper being fastest to 60 sold in the US... why dont you check out the saleen S7, Porsche 996 TT, Ferrari Enzo etc. they are all there or faster! second off if you obviously know nothing about fords dont open your mouth. and as to the reference on the ride of the Z06... it was lousy compared to the likes of my dads porsche 996TT, my old bosses viper hennessee 650, and his lambo diablo. so no you are mistaken with the comparison to real sports car! DUMBA$$!

[Slim]

I think some people need to click here and read the first few paragraphs... (http://www.grandamgt.com/forum_guidelines.html)

[GTManiac]

Originally posted by Slim25
I think some people need to click here and read the first few paragraphs... (http://www.grandamgt.com/forum_guidelines.html)

*offtopic*

I KNEW this thread wasn't gonna go much further without someone HAVING to point those out.

Heaven's forbid a discussion become heated and someone whip out the bird. It's not like we're sitting here having a name calling (well I'm not anyways.) competition and we're not exchanging addresses to go meet up and beat each other up. We're not ranting and raving about a certain bodykit company (like some people who can't get past that rant...) We're also not dissing GM, Grand Ams, or this site. So WHERE'S the problem? :confused: :rolleyes:

[Licit]

Originally posted by 95-GT
hmm...my buddies stock GT 5-speed ran a 13.9. He now runs a 13.4 with some bolt ons....you thinik your grand am will be showing them ur tail lights?
What year Stang GT is it? I'm really surprised if it is in the '99-'02 range since even Car and Driver's test guys only ran the 1/4 in 15.1 seconds. Now if you are talking a Mach 1 then that is a solid 14 second flat in the 1/4 and not one of the LESSER stangs I was eluding to. I'm not sure what the pre 99 StangGT's ran and that may be the years you are talking about. There's no way I would try to show my tail lights to a good running GT, especially not with someone who knows how to drive it. I was more talking about the people around here that don't even know how to harness the power of a Mustang, whatever model, they are the ones that get to see my taillights:thumbs:

[1993Grandamgt]

the Bullit mustang was a turd when it came to performance. you payed 5 grand more for 10-15 extra horsepower than the 260 hp in the gt... but the Mach 1 was nice with its 305 horses and the same money as a bullit, but the king is definitely the 03 cobra with 390 horse and a 6 speed.

[95-GT]

Licit, it is a 2003 GT stang, short throw shifter, custom x-pipe, american thunder cat-back flowmasters, and a gutter airbox. This kid DOES know how to drive the car too.

[Licit]

I had to assume he knew how to drive it since he running 13's with it, damn it must be nice to run those times in the 1/4. So do you know if this years was increased horsepower/torque from stock? Or does the tranny just have that much better gear ratios? There had to have been some pretty decent changes if he was running a full second and 2/10 faster than the '02's. Back to the SVT I was reading Car and Drivers 4-seat speedster comparo. Against the Mazda RX-8 and the Infiniti G35 Coupe the SVT won out for 1/4 mile easy but also lap times at a Southern California speedway. Of course Car and Driver who just love a damn import, ranked it 3rd. But that was owing more to things like the car felt "tall" and the backseat was not roomy. I doubt many people on this board care about that stuff. Funny that American engineering gets knocked alot of times for lacks in steering and suspension but the SVT smoked those 2 cars that are far from lame around a racetrack.

[95-GT]

I didnt even see that, but that is bull****.

[1993Grandamgt]

it is bullsh!t. i was in a wawa convienience store when i read that article, and started yelling. then i realized people were staring at me so i put it down and quickly left! lol

[Greed4Speed]

I'm not a Ford guy, but the new Cobra does American Iron justice. Its about time the 4cyl turbo crowd gets to see what a factory American V8 supercharged engine can do. I think Ford was stupid for not building a 5.4L Stang earlier. They'd have competed with the LT1 and LS1 that way and not had to supercharge. Not that supercharging is a bad thing. I'd like to run one.

Still, 12.9 in the 1/4 isn't that impressive for a S/C V8. I was expecting it to be faster. An LS1 F-body with a few bolt ons can run that N/A.

[AznGA]

I think right now, I would take Cobra over Z06.

[Licit]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
it is bullsh!t. i was in a wawa convienience store when i read that article, and started yelling. then i realized people were staring at me so i put it down and quickly left! lol
I'm glad you and 95-GT agree with me, actually most of Car and Drivers readers did too. The next month had several letters to the editor stating that, in short, Car and Driver needed to pull their skirts up and make sure they still had equipment down there. I expected it though, my aunt has renewed my subscription every year for a few now for Xmas. I like their detail of cars and write-ups, but they sure are not motorheads. To C&D it's like anything German has secret miracle power that American car companies can't figure out(gee look at the price a-holes). And the Japanese are just so innovative. They get so excited also about crap like plush interior styling, ergonmic and relaxingly-comfortable seating. Sometimes I feel like I'm reading something one of my girlfriends would write. Hell I want to read about cars, direct fuel-injection and supercharger whine that'll make cops get scared. They can leave the Martha Stewart crap and low-ranking anything American alone. You know they also complained because the Vipers running boards get too hot, and called it's ride the equivalent of a rental-trucks. Sorry Car and Driver, Dodges PVO team was a little busy making a car that'll SMOKE!!!! any damn Mercedes or BMW you want to match it up against!:clap:

[Licit]

Greed4Speed, in defense of the SVT Cobra, it is a tick over a liter short on displacement from the LS1. I know the SVT spokesman on the project said they did about all they could to a point while at the same time keeping cost in mind. Nothing against LS1 F-bodies at all, I love'em(and what you said is true), I just think if they would have bumped a couple more thousand in the Cobra we'd see a lower time in the 1/4. Unfortunately the bottom line tends to lean toward a lower price.

[95-GT]

The supercharger also has the advantage of less drivetrain loss, and swapping the pulley on it for awsome gains.

[Lash]

I think that we are all forgeting that ford had to pu S/C's on their V8 muscle car to make it go faster than the GM V8. Now imagine a LS1 S/C 'ed from factory!!! SICK!!!

[95-GT]

lol...look at it also...a 4.6L compared to a 5.7L. All for the same price too. Not to mention fords DOHC heads. Admit it or not, but the 03 cobra is more powerful and a better engine design then the LS1's out of the factory. Slap a s/c on the LS1 for $4000, and drop $4,000 into some upgrades onm the stang, and see what it does then.

[Greed4Speed]

It isn't GM's fault Ford hasn't had the nards to put a larger engine than an F-body in the Stang since the early 70's. Ford people have been talking the extra cubic inch trash for years. It doesn't matter. That is what Ford gave ya. I personally can't believe Ford hasn't made a 5.4L GT yet. They'd sell like crazy!

Personally, I prefer the LS1 design over the modular engines. Ya, the new Cobra is rated at 390 HP, but like I said the LS1 rated at over 50 hp less (which is what should matter, not the cubic inched) can run high 12's with minor bolt ons. Then again, there is the naturally aspirated Anniversary SS w/345 HP rating that'll run with the supercharged Cobra. W/ 390 HP, the Cobra should be running faster. Even with the Cobra, whats up w/the GTs? They are still under powered IMO. I test drove some before I went with the SS. My first words when the salesman asked me how I liked it were, its a DOG!" The Mach isn't all the fast either. It w/the much bragged about dual overhead cammed heads is still slower than a Z28 or Formula LS1. Thats not even comparing it to a SS, WS6, or Firehawk.

This is my whole point. I expected low 12's at the least with the HP rating. Guess it doesn't have the torque to get it moving quick enough or is under geared or grossly overweight. Ford let all you Mustang guys down if it'll only turn those timeslips and yet you still defend them. WAKE UP! Quit making excuses. Cars with 50 HP less are running those times! Ya, you can go faster with a smaller pulley, but it should be faster than that stock! Especially with the high pricetag.

[1993Grandamgt]

my cobra is coming in Aug. wanna run me? ;)

[Licit]

To say that 390hp should run low 12's can't be expected all the time like clockwork. You hit the nail on the head about weight though, it plumps it's booty at around 3800 lbs. The first thing I plan to do to mine if/when I get it is weight reduction. Knock weight out and put the pulley on and there you go. Look at the Viper SRT-10, 500hp/525lb.ft. torque and runs 12.1/12.2 in the 1/4. If 390/390 should run low 12's then 500/525 should be running mid 11's. I don't even see numbers on LS1 F-bodies(Camaro/Firebird) since they aren't made anymore so I can't compare on those. Would you knock Dodge and the Viper though in the same way as Ford with the SVT Cobra? I completey agree with the non-SVT Stangs comment, having also test drove a GT.

[1993Grandamgt]

what weighs 3800 ibs? the cobra? that weighs in at 3450 LBS. by mid winter this year my cobra will have some lethal venom. namely the Kenne Bell supercharger upgrade, full exhaust, 4.11 gears etc. (yeas the 4.11's will work due to it being a 6 speed.)

[Licit]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
what weighs 3800 ibs? the cobra? that weighs in at 3450 LBS. by mid winter this year my cobra will have some lethal venom. namely the Kenne Bell supercharger upgrade, full exhaust, 4.11 gears etc. (yeas the 4.11's will work due to it being a 6 speed.)
What year do you have? According to Car and Driver's specs in the June 2002 issue, curb weight = 3738 pounds. I'm sure the easiest way to find out would be to look on the inside of the door on one, but since I don't own one and this town doesn't even have one on a lot I can't do that. Did you get that number off the Ford website, door panel, just wondering?

[95-GT]

Also compare the price of a dodge viper srt-10 to a mustang cobra svt :D

1993Grandamgt....I can get you ANY gear size that ford has for cheap straight from the factory. Let me know if your intrested in a set of 4.10's

[1993Grandamgt]

i just ordered the 2003. by the way curb weiht is not the weight of the car. that is what the car weighs plus maximum passenger capacity. my old mustang had a curb weight of 3550 (88 GT) but it was full weight not stripped and with me in the car it only weighed 3295. and i weighed 175 LBS at the time. (now 185 LBS). the weight i told you for the cobra was from MM&FF magazine when the test drove the car and had it weighed at the track!

95-GT... that will be cool! i will let you know bro! how much would it cost? (it has an 8.8 rear)

[95-GT]

Probley like $100-$150 plus shipping. is that cheap?

[1993Grandamgt]

thats about average with what i paid before for gears. minus install kit.

[95-GT]

Get some prices for 8.8" 4.10 gears, and I can work with you. I get them free but my dad sells them. lol

[1993Grandamgt]

cool will do!

[Greed4Speed]

Would you knock Dodge and the Viper though in the same way as Ford with the SVT Cobra?

Yes. It think it is extremely sad that thats all they run, but they are also 3.08 geared and still very traction limited. Even then, for the price you'd pay to get one you'd think Dodge should have ironed out some traction problems. Don't get me wrong. The Viper and Cobra are nice cars, but for supposedly being so powerful and technologically advanced those are not that great of ET's.

As for F-body times. Most are mid to low 13's @ 320 HP. They'll do high 12's w/basic bolt ons, some have gotten 12's totally stock. Then you have the 345 HP Anniversary editions, :thumbs: easily in the 12's there w/out the aid of an aluminum lung. They got the 345 HP w/ the optional SLP bolt ons.

So is the supercharged 390 HP really doing all that for ya at 12.90? Buy an LS1 for over $10K less and supercharge it and you'll be low 12's to high 11's. Just a cam change and you'll be in the low 12's and still have cash left over for more mods and still be able to run 87 octane gas.

my cobra is coming in Aug. wanna run me?

You might want to give it a little break in milage. lol From what I've been hearing Ford is being very strict on the warranty with the new Cobras. But ya, I'd still race ya just to see how well my totally stock, naturally aspirated, single cammed, push rod engine would hang.

One thing for the Stangs. The 8.8 rear is waaaaay better than the 7.5 POS GM stuck us with.

[1993Grandamgt]

i will definitely agree with that. my friend has a 96 Z with a 6 speed and a 383 stroker with a vortech blower and hes broke quite a few axle shafts and ring and pinions already!

[95-GT]

Comparing the engines tho....a 4.6L beating a 5.7L and hanging with the vipers 8.3L.

[Greed4Speed]

A SUPERCHARGED 4.6L. You have to factor that into the equation. Do the same to an LS1 and it'll be a lot quicker for less $. I've seen turbocharged 3.8L's in much heavier cars run faster than the Cobra if you want to play the engine displacement game. Ever hear of a GNX? The N/A single cammed 4.6 is a DOG!

FYI: an LS1 isn't realy a 5.7L. A 350 is a 5.7L an LS1 is a 346. Its more like a 5.6 or 5.5L but GM stuck w/th 5.7 designation for the name recognition.

[Licit]

Well thanks for the curb weight clarification, I never knew that was how it was figured. Do they usually average the weight of 4 or 5 passengers, like use the average person weight of 175 lbs times 4 or 5? Greed4Speed what do you think of the Ferrari 575 Maranello with the 12 cylinder running 12.6 in the 1/4? Please tell me you agree it's pathetic. Then again it's not like the owners of these house-priced cars go running to the track. I'm so sick of my buddy saying "my sister's Ferrari....". Just to **** him off I always say it's overpriced euro trash, it's hilarious how mad he gets.

[Panacea]

Okay, had to chime in really quick...

All from Motortrend

Mach1 = 13.8 second 1/4
2003 SVT Cobra = 13.12@109.58
2003 Corvette = 13.02 @ 109.59
2003 ZO6 = Couldn't find

So, a stock SVT Cobra runs 13.12 and a STOCK Corvette, not ZO6 runs 13.02.

That means the ZO6 w/50 more HP runs in the 12's.

So stock for stock the base end corvette beats the SVT, and the ZO6 will still stomp it.

Oh, and do you guys want to talk about displacement? Let me find a 89 TT Trans Am... 12 or 13 second 1/4 out of a turbo'd 3.8L V6, is that fair now? Cheaper car, smaller displacement, faster still.

GM has it all the way. :thumbs:

[1993Grandamgt]

but i thought you were done with these threads concerning cobra mustangs vs. Z06, Panacea!

[1993Grandamgt]

here you go Panacea:

Car-Stats.com Report for 2003 Chevrolet Corvette Z06
Obtained from R&T March, 2003
0-60: 4.5 Transmission: Manual
1/4 Mile: 12.8
1/4 Speed: 114

Car-Stats.com Report for 2003 Ford Mustang Cobra
Obtained from C&D June, 2002
0-60: 4.5 Transmission: Manual
1/4 Mile: 12.9
1/4 Speed: 111

[Panacea]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
but i thought you were done with these threads concerning cobra mustangs vs. Z06, Panacea!

I was, but then I was bored.

Then people started talking about displacement so I had to bring up the TT 3.8 Trans Am, and yeah. The argument doesn't fly cause, well, GM won hands down :thumbs:

BTW what kind of mileage does the SVT Get? Can it get 28-31mpg like the vette?

[1993Grandamgt]

since when was that 1989 trans am a twin turbo? i always was tod it was a single turbo on it! and i dont know the mileage off hand. i will find it for you though.

[1993Grandamgt]

by the way here is the link on info for the 1989 turbo trans am:

http://www.89tta.com/

[Panacea]

Meh so I was wrong, oh well.

1/4 13.5 not too shabby for having more than 100 less HP and less displacement than the SC 4.5L or whatever the Cobra has.

[1993Grandamgt]

i have nothing to say about that T/A, i always liked that car.

[Panacea]

Anyone know the reason why they did the Turbo that year? Was it stricktly for being a Pace Car, or was it an anniversary? Also, why they haven't made more cars like that? I mean c'mon 250hp and a 13.5 second 1/4.... and a TURBO!!!

[1993Grandamgt]

probably because of the profit margins, and exclusivity.

[Licit]

Yeah they don't turbo many American cars. Audi and Volvo sure love them though don't they. I have to admit I was pretty impressed with the power on my friends moms VW Beetle 1.8T. I absolutely HATE the look of them and the fact I always have sorority girls around town here trying to show me up in them. Still I have noticed the turbo lag in cars with them, definately prefer a supercharged engine to a turbo. I have a feeling we'll see more turbos being put in now that performance has become important. Or at least the whole "we're going to run out of oil, and emissions are ruining the environment" crap has taken a back seat somewhat.

[Greed4Speed]

Greed4Speed what do you think of the Ferrari 575 Maranello with the 12 cylinder running 12.6 in the 1/4? Please tell me you agree it's pathetic. Then again it's not like the owners of these house-priced cars go running to the track. I'm so sick of my buddy saying "my sister's Ferrari....". Just to **** him off I always say it's overpriced euro trash, it's hilarious how mad he gets.

Far from impressed w/a 12.6 in that expensive of a car, but they also aren't designed for drag either but more for road racing and top end. That and the 12 cylinders are also very small cylinders. I'd expect an American muscle car to be geared and designed for some dragging.

I did see a Testerosa at the track one night. The tree lit up and he stomped on it and a large cloud of smoke billowed out of his engine bay and exhaust. I don't know what he broke, but he limped it to ~ a 25 second run. lol

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
here you go Panacea:

Car-Stats.com Report for 2003 Chevrolet Corvette Z06
Obtained from R&T March, 2003
0-60: 4.5 Transmission: Manual
1/4 Mile: 12.8
1/4 Speed: 114

Car-Stats.com Report for 2003 Ford Mustang Cobra
Obtained from C&D June, 2002
0-60: 4.5 Transmission: Manual
1/4 Mile: 12.9
1/4 Speed: 111

Here ya go 1993Grandamgt: http://136.160.33.249/phpBB2/videos/bbq/tim_evan.mpeg

Stock to stock Z06 vs. '03 Cobra, Cobra gets smacked. Even with a good launch you can tell he was doomed to loose.

[Vinaashak]

Viper SRT-10's can run 11.8 stock at 122. Just thought i would straighten up everones numbers.

[1993Grandamgt]

Originally posted by VTECSiGAH8R
Here ya go 1993Grandamgt: http://136.160.33.249/phpBB2/videos/bbq/tim_evan.mpeg

Stock to stock Z06 vs. '03 Cobra, Cobra gets smacked. Even with a good launch you can tell he was doomed to loose.

do you want me to :clap: for a non stock Z06? first off i hate to tell you that is the sound of long tube headers with an aftermarket exhaust my friend... but even so it wouldnt amount to that much of a lead. 1 second quicker in the 1/4 is equivelant to about 1/2 a car length, did anyone check his car for a little spray?. but if you listen to that clip of yours you will hear the driver of the cobra feathering the throttle on launch to try and get traction, and a missed shift . nice race though! how did you shut off that road in the middle of the day?:thumbs:

[95-GT]

Sounds to me like a Corsa exhaust kit

[1993Grandamgt]

i was thinking B&B exhaust, as my buddies Z06 has that exhaust and thats exactly the way his sounds. stock it wasnt that crackly sounding

[VTECSiGAH8R]

I know there are bone stock 2002 and 2003 Z06s running low low 12's (like 12.1) and even an 11.99 I've seen the slips for. I don't think any stock '03 Cobras have managed that. It would be really hard to imagine even a freak Cobra pulling it's doggish 3600-3900 lb curb weight down the track for low 12's stock.

[Panacea]

http://www.jakeszone.com/zo6timeslip.jpg

BLU-BY-U
Year Z06: 2002
Location: Houston, Tx
Date: 03/22/02
Temperature: 57° F


Mods: Bonestock

Reaction Time: .795
60' Time: 1.961
Trap Speed: 116.96
Time: 12.104

[Panacea]

http://www.corvetteforum.net/c5/ranger/Images/Ranger.Timeslip.011209.jpg

Ranger
Year Z06: 2001
Location: Beyond the Beltway in Maryland
Date: 12/09/01
Temperature: 53° F


Mods: BFG 315 drag radials

Reaction Time: 0.66
60' Time: 1.82
Trap Speed: 116.65
Time: 11.948

[1993Grandamgt]

neither of those time slips say what car it is, for all i know it could be your neighbors drag chevelle or something. the last one says ranger. who or what is ranger. i know of a FORD RANGER that does those times. lol... seriously i do. but man very nice cold weather for running good times! low to mid 50's to accomplish very high 11's ....... impressive

[VTECSiGAH8R]

One of the stock slips I saw was running like 12.1 at 100+ degrees at the track. I saw several at the 12.1 level and another at 11.99 and then the one above at like 11.948. What are the chances that all of them are faking it? 405 hp + 3300 lb curb weight (maybe less with weight mods) and you get low 12s if you can shift right and get good traction.

[1993Grandamgt]

you know this debate will never be one as everyones views are different. i like cobras you guys like the Z06..... it will never rest.

[Panacea]

first of all what drag strip actually puts the make and model of the vehicle on their timeslips, and second of all, Ranger is the guys alias on the website I got those from.

[1993Grandamgt]

the point i was trying to make is there is no way for us really to verify the vehicle at hand

[95-GT]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
you know this debate will never be one as everyones views are different. i like cobras you guys like the Z06..... it will never rest.

It will never end...but the truth is that the cobra has more horsepower and torque per dollar.

[1993Grandamgt]

exactly my points i was trying to make. for the money you saved you can take 2 more people with you, and have enuff money to mod the hell out of it.

[Panacea]

Yes, that is all true, but in the end... It's still a mustang.

[1993Grandamgt]

same with the Z06 its still only a vette! nothing special........

[95-GT]

Z06- $135.80 per 1 HP
SVT- $80.00 per 1 HP

[Spirok]

Originally posted by Panacea
Yes, that is all true, but in the end... It's still a mustang.

Exactly...:thumbs:

[95-GT]

hmm...dump $20,000 into a mustang and what do you have then?

[1993Grandamgt]

one hell of a fast car that is cheaper than a vette!!!..........

[Panacea]

Originally posted by 95-GT
hmm...dump $20,000 into a mustang and what do you have then?

A Mustang?

Buy a '96 vette and put $20,000 into it and what do you have? A vette that's a heck of a lot faster than that rustang you just put $20,000 into, and it was cheaper... :rolleyes:

[95-GT]

But consider that the 96 vette is 7 yrs old compared to a brand new mustang. Take a 88 foxbody mustang, dump $20k into that, and what do you have? A 9 second car.

[Panacea]

You could do that with a vette too. But still, who wants a 9 second mustang? Especially the ugly foxbodies? lol

You know this is gonna go on and on, right? haha

[1993Grandamgt]

yepp lets see how long this thread will go haha lol j/k.... seriously the fox chassis may be ugly but they are light weight and fairly nimble for a 24 yr old chassis made from a ford futura/ mercury zephyr.......

[1993Grandamgt]

by the way who would want a 9 sec vette either? id rather have a 10 sec mustang that handles rather than have a 9 sec dedicated drag car!

[Panacea]

lol that's funny...

But seriously, I wasn't talking about the chasis being ugly... I was talking about the body being ugly. Haha, it reminds me of a hatchback escort.

Why did ford do away with the 5.0's anyway?

[Panacea]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
by the way who would want a 9 sec vette either? id rather have a 10 sec mustang that handles rather than have a 9 sec dedicated drag car!

See, contrary to popular belief, vettes aren't supposed to go in just the 1/4, they're supposed to have great handling too! The vette will outhandle the mustang any day of the week. I use to have a video to prove it too! Had like 5-10 cars going through the twisties...

One was an SVT Cobra, another a stock vette or a stock Z06, a Porsche, a Mclaren, a viper, and a few others. Thing is the Vette and the Porcsche did the best. Everyone else kept spinning out.

[1993Grandamgt]

the mod motors aka 4.6's, 5.4's, and v10, were supposed to be better on economy, have less NVH, and also lighter motors with same or more power than standard pushrod motors. they figured with the overhead cam design motors it was the way of the future... well it is and these motors even though very much hated when introduced respond very well to mods.

[ZakkWylde470]

Originally posted by Panacea


Why did ford do away with the 5.0's anyway?

LOL, have you seen FRRP's new crate motor? Modular 4-cam 5.0L that puts out between 430-450 HP.

[1993Grandamgt]

another perfect example of the mod motor. its a DOHC 4.6 cobra motor that has a big bore kit on it! sweet..... absolutely sweet

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
same with the Z06 its still only a vette! nothing special........

That's right, nothing special about a Vette that can run low 12's stock on stock street tires with and N/A engine and can pull a lateral g in the skidpad and has an advanced magnetism suspension that can adjust itself precisely 1000 times a second.

Has anyone even bothered to take the '03 Cobra to autocross yet?? If so, I don't see why when a freaking SVT Focus handles better.

But I know you're getting an '03 Cobra so that couldn't have anything to do with why you're defending it so well. :rolleyes:

Both are nice, and you get what you pay for in both cases as one is raw muscle and one is a well rounded performance car with amazing power and handling, nuff said.

[1993Grandamgt]

as i said before the primary reason i am defending the cobra is because i am a diehard ford fan, always have been, always will be. in my eyes the Cobra is a better buy for themoney $80 per horse is better than $1xx per horse. i used to like the vettes untill they killed the king of the hill ZR1. now all vettes are overrated, and everyone owns them. just like mustangs, ands hondas its like an A$$hole everyone has one

[Black Z28]

Originally posted by 95-GT
lol...look at it also...a 4.6L compared to a 5.7L. All for the same price too. Not to mention fords DOHC heads. Admit it or not, but the 03 cobra is more powerful and a better engine design then the LS1's out of the factory. Slap a s/c on the LS1 for $4000, and drop $4,000 into some upgrades onm the stang, and see what it does then.
oh give me a break. ford's DOHC is garbage. for years GM's f-bodies have whamped on all of ford's mustangs. this was the first cobra faster than an f-body, but too bad they had to put a SC on it... oh and my car was 4k less than the cobra.... which is just about enough for me to put a nice ATI Procharger on it and push around 475 to the wheels.

[95-GT]

Slap a $50 pulley on that supercharger and thats what you have also at the wheels.

[1993Grandamgt]

and for that 4k you were stating to have that ATI procharger, i can have a full exhaust, cams, blower pulley, shortie shifter, and money for gas, plus when i get tired of this cobra, I CAN GO TRADE MINE IN ON A NEW ONE! but thats right the f-bodies cant do that, so obviously they suck because they were canceled due to lack of sales!

[1993Grandamgt]

or for 4k i can just get a kenne bell supercharger to replace the factory one and get up to 617 RWHP. here is the link BRO:

http://www.kennebell.net/superchargers/ford/cobra03/cobra03.htm

[Black Z28]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
or for 4k i can just get a kenne bell supercharger to replace the factory one and get up to 617 RWHP. here is the link BRO:

http://www.kennebell.net/superchargers/ford/cobra03/cobra03.htm

you don't understand what i said. i said for the price difference between yours and my cars (about 4k) i'd be pushing around 475

[1993Grandamgt]

ummm yeah i understood..... but i was just stating a fact that for 4k's what i would be pushing... but thats the thing the cobra is going to be alive and well for quite a while... keep yours stock so it maybe worth something someday, unless you dont care.

[Panacea]

Also, the $80 per HP for the Cobra and the $1xx for the vette... Sure if you look at it that way the Cobra's on top. But you're forgetting that if the Vette had the same handling the Cobra did, it'd be the same price... The extra $15k is in ride quality/handling. :thumbs:

[Greed4Speed]

When your Stock Cobras can out run a Stock LS1 F-body w/out the aid of positive air pressure then you can say F-bodies suck. You talk about HP/$. The F-body has the cobra bent. I can run 87 octane w/out pinging, can your supercharged Cobra? For a supercharged supposedly 390 hp (or more because Ford people think it is underrated) to run only 12.9 is just SAD! That is what a STOCK 345 HP naturally aspirated LS1 F-body runs, if it doesn't run quicker.

You can claim your HP/$ is cheaper all day long against a Vette, but in the end the Vette will still have a far better resale value.

I liked that video. You Stang guys claimed the Vette was all modded, but that Cobra sure thought he needed to heat up his tires. The only tires you need to heat up are drag tires. Guess drag radials aren't considered a mod if it doesn't benefit your position, or the driver was just an idiot that didn't know not to "heat up" regular radials.

I'll admit, the new Cobra is a nice car, but should be much quicker for what it is supposed to be.

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by Panacea
Also, the $80 per HP for the Cobra and the $1xx for the vette... Sure if you look at it that way the Cobra's on top. But you're forgetting that if the Vette had the same handling the Cobra did, it'd be the same price... The extra $15k is in ride quality/handling. :thumbs:

Not to mention that a Z06 will turn my head b4 an '03 Cobra anyday.

[95-GT]

well 1993Grandamgt....we can both see that people cant accept the fact that a 03 cobra is much more powerful then a f-body and just as well performed as the $20k+ corvette.

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by 95-GT
well 1993Grandamgt....we can both see that people cant accept the fact that a 03 cobra is much more powerful then a f-body and just as well performed as the $20k+ corvette.

Yes, that's right, noone can see that the '03 Cobra performs as well as a Z06. Maybe because it doesn't?? Show me an '03 Cobra that can handle as well as the Vette stock to stock and I'll give in. Hell, try to find a suspension modded '03 Cobra that can do it and I'll give in. Then try and find one that can hand a Z06 it's ass in the 1/4 stock to stock and I'll give in. I'm so tired of this $ per hp crap. When you bought your grandam, did you only look at $ per hp. I hope not cuz you prolly got ripped compared to the allmighty '03 Cobra. :rolleyes:

[Panacea]

Originally posted by VTECSiGAH8R
Yes, that's right, noone can see that the '03 Cobra performs as well as a Z06. Maybe because it doesn't?? Show me an '03 Cobra that can handle as well as the Vette stock to stock and I'll give in. Hell, try to find a suspension modded '03 Cobra that can do it and I'll give in. Then try and find one that can hand a Z06 it's ass in the 1/4 stock to stock and I'll give in. I'm so tired of this $ per hp crap. When you bought your grandam, did you only look at $ per hp. I hope not cuz you prolly got ripped compared to the allmighty '03 Cobra. :rolleyes:

:woowoo

[Black Z28]

Originally posted by Panacea
:woowoo

x2

[Panacea]

Originally posted by VTECSiGAH8R
Then try and find one that can hand a Z06 it's ass in the 1/4 stock to stock and I'll give in. I'm so tired of this $ per hp crap. When you bought your grandam, did you only look at $ per hp. I hope not cuz you prolly got ripped compared to the allmighty '03 Cobra. :rolleyes:

Vtec, I think you gave them a 1% margin there... See, it's one thing to be fast, but then to have the handling on top of it... Yeah...

Show us a Mustang that can do BOTH, then we may look up :)

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by Panacea
Vtec, I think you gave them a 1% margin there... See, it's one thing to be fast, but then to have the handling on top of it... Yeah...

Show us a Mustang that can do BOTH, then we may look up :)

But then they might point out the 1999 Cobra R. But that's just something to laugh at right there. Ford made a N/A engine with 390 hp that couldn't keep up with the regular C5 0-60, in the 1/4, or top speed, and it prolly cost whoever bought one more money than the C5 and it had NO A/C and No radio. I think it may have outhandled the C5 by a little, but later the Z06 would be made which was and still is even faster in all those respects and handles better than the Cobra R.

So Ford's very special limited edition attempt to truely mimic the Vette failed in all ways, price, speed, and handling. And you expect us to believe that the mass produced (well, moreso than the Cobra R) '03 Cobra is better than the Z06 just because it responds better to mods and costs $20,000 less? There's a reason it's less.

[Panacea]

Do you think now is the time to bring up the 99 SVT Cobra? :D

[1993Grandamgt]

oh one thing we never brought up on here is the saleen S281E. considered factory stock as well... just like the ss camaro done outside of fords plant but still a factory tuner car. will outrun a Z06 and handle as well if not better... how about that and a more comparable price to the Z06???? now whatcha gotta say?

[95-GT]

But then again....I forgot that this is AMERICA....the home of drag racing, not sissy track racing.

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by 95-GT
But then again....I forgot that this is AMERICA....the home of drag racing, not sissy track racing.

Good point.




































:rollmy****ingeyes:

[Panacea]

So, 95, you think the LeMans, or similar sport is for Pussies? Yeah, okay... whatever you say. Pass the crack pipe this way please.

Besides, the Vette has the best of Both worlds.


Oh, and '93, how much would one of those Saleens run?

Cause you know what? Lingenfelter can be considered Factory Option too...

[95-GT]

S281- $39,000.
S281E Class- $57,000 - 425 Horsepower.

I am also from MotorCity where dragracing is the biggest thing VTEC and Pan. Out here in Michigan, I dont know one person who likes track racing and everyone loves drag racing. Like in my sub, we have a viper, a 1900 horsepower SuperBee, a 69 Original Shelby Cobra, about 4 mustangs that fo 10's. A 9 second street legal monte carlo and more.

[2002GT]

Hmmm... I would take the 03 Cobra over a Z06

[95-GT]

I have to bust these out. Factory Freak Cobra: http://www.cybergeorge.net/mustang/500-MTIDyno.mpg

452.9 RWHP
432.8 RWTQ

[95-GT]

12.1 @ 119 MPH

http://www.cybergeorge.net/mustang/TrackJanSBCEvilcartmanHQ.mpg

[1993Grandamgt]

ZL-1 600 hp / 575 tq

what about that boss mustang a few years ago with the 600+ ci motor... something like 750 hp or so..

[1993Grandamgt]

95 GT what is done to that Cobra? that is a nice car!

[95-GT]

Its just a bone stock cobra. He is pushing about 550 RWHP now with a Magnaflow Catback, Magnaflow Catted X pipe, Nathaniel's Cold Air Kit, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, Nathaniel's Subframe Connector's, Lightning Upper Blower Pulley

[1993Grandamgt]

damn!!!! do you know the guy? thats a freak stock ford for sure

[Panacea]

So just because I live in Illinois means I heard sheep? Just becasue you live in the Motor City doesn't mean crap. It takes little skill to drag race. Sure you have to have quick reaction times, but that's about it.

It takes a hell of a lot more skill to road race. You have to be able to think ahead, adjust your speed at the last second, judged distances, etc. etc.

[1993Grandamgt]

by the way Panacea i used to compete in SCCA SoloII in my 88 GT stang... what credentials do you have again?

[Panacea]

I'm an Astro Physicist...

What's credentials have to do with anything? I mean, look at Bush... He's president is he not? Just because you have credentials doesn't mean you're fit for the job or know what you're doing :thumbs:

[1993Grandamgt]

true... but you sit there and say all this stuf about real driving like you know how to do it! when you may be the worst person behind the wheel......... i dunno i am going back to sleep now since i am starting to even confuse myself! lol

[Panacea]

It doesn't take an Astro Physicist to know that it's more difficult to go around curves than it is to go in a straight line.

If you don't believe me than ask Matt Fuller... He road races all the time, and well, I'm pretty sure he'll agree w/me.

[1993Grandamgt]

i never said it wasnt harder............

[StarFire]

If I had my choice of a Cobra or Vette, I'd take the vette. All for the simple reason of the interior. The vette's interior is designed far better (IMO) over the mustang's.

[Greed4Speed]

well 1993Grandamgt....we can both see that people cant accept the fact that a 03 cobra is much more powerful then a f-body and just as well performed as the $20k+ corvette.

What you Ford people like to overlook is the 2002 35th anniversary F-bodies that run as fast if not faster than the new Cobra. They do this with a 45 HP less than the Cobra and naturally aspirated.

You brought up a Mach 1 that was 600HP, well we can bring up the ZL1 Camaro w/an 8.4L making 770HP and 683 lb/ft. You wanna bring in the Saleen, well what about Berger Camaros w/ 380hp & 400 lb/ft tq (runs low 12's easily); or the Mecham F-bodies that can be had in engines from the LS1 to the 6.5L engine. These are cars that can be bought at a dealership w/all the warraties etc.

check this one out w/442 HP from an LS1 and under $20000. http://adcache.collectorcartraderonline.com/10/6/6/48755666.htm

Buy your $35000 Cobra, but when a stock engined naturally aspirated F-body (not necessarily an SS or WS6) out runs you with a $500 mod ( the cost of a rear gear + installation) then you'll understand. Think about it. There are Z28's and Formulas running low 13's w/2.73 gears and an automatic. These are cars rated at 60 HP LESS than your vaunted 390 HP supercharged all so wonderful super fast dual overhead cammed hi-tek modular engine that are going to be hanging with you if not out running you.

Anyone remember the Mustang II, or was that a Pinto GT or something? There has yet to be a GM pony car THAT ugly.

As for this being America and the home a drag racing, it is also the home of NASCAR, which just so happens to be the most watched motorsport. Still think top speed and handling doesn't matter to Americans? As for one taking more skill than the other, I'd disagree. It's apples and oranges. You try driving a topfuel rail with those bicycle tires to steer in a straight line in under 5 sec at over 300 mph w/out lifting the front end or lighting it up on the take off or red lining. Both racing types require certain skills.

[95-GT]

Like i said also, i am from Motorcity...where we all here LOVE drag racing.

[1993Grandamgt]

how about the Saleen SR? the only thing is the price 150G's. i will get performance times tomarrow








ALL-NEW 2002 SALEEN SR PROVIDES ULTIMATE PERFORMANCE

SR Blends High Performance With Race Technology

The 2002 SR from Saleen takes "street performance" to its ultimate.

With an energizing 505 horsepower from its 5.8 liter Saleen Centrifugal Supercharged V-8 engine and a Saleen Racecraft designed independent rear suspension, the SR takes curves with the same force as it does straightaways.

"We've used our racing experience on the track and adapted this technology in the engineering of the SR to create the ultimate street performance vehicle," said Steve Saleen, president and founder of Saleen Inc. "The SR goes from 0-60 mph 'very quickly' and hits a quarter mile speed 'very fast.'"

The 2002 SR is highlighted by Saleen's 5.8-liter Ford-based engine producing 505 hp and 500 lbs of torque mated to a Saleen six-speed transmission. A custom Saleen drive shaft leads to an IRS differential system at a gear ratio of 3.55:1. Braking is through 14.4" front rotors with four-piston calipers. Rear brakes are 13.0" metallic discs with four-piston calipers. Unibody construction features a complete roll cage and suspension reinforcement system. A refined Saleen Racecraft suspension includes independent uneven length double wishbones with Saleen N2 triple adjustable shocks and adjustable sway bars in the front and a Saleen-designed push-pull Independent rear suspension. The SR also includes power assisted rack and pinion steering. Additional features include race inspired seats and a white instrument gauge cluster with a 200 mph speedometer.

The Saleen SR boasts exterior aerodynamic refinements beyond the base complete body panels of the Saleen S281, including a specialty-designed composite hood, composite rear bodywork and underbody tunnel. The SR was wind-tunnel tuned at Lockheed-Martin's full-size tunnel in Marietta, Georgia. The SR comes standard with 18" wheels and Pirelli P-Zero tires. Every body part is unique to the Saleen SR, with the exception of the windows.

The Saleen SR is available as a coupe only. The retail price for the Saleen SR starts at $150,000. Like all Saleen vehicles, the 2002 SR is available only at Saleen Certified Ford Dealers nationwide.

Saleen manufacturing facilities include complete research, engineering, design and assembly capability. The Saleen SR meets all the same Federal government regulations as those of large automobile manufacturers, and come with a full factory warranty.

Since the company's inception in 1984, Saleen has produced over 9,000 vehicles, more than any other specialty manufacturer. The company's line includes Saleen Mustangs, and Saleen Performance Parts - a complete line of performance and appearance products for Mustangs.

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by 1993Grandamgt
how about the Saleen SR? the only thing is the price 150G's. i will get performance times tomarrow








ALL-NEW 2002 SALEEN SR PROVIDES ULTIMATE PERFORMANCE

SR Blends High Performance With Race Technology

The 2002 SR from Saleen takes "street performance" to its ultimate.

With an energizing 505 horsepower from its 5.8 liter Saleen Centrifugal Supercharged V-8 engine and a Saleen Racecraft designed independent rear suspension, the SR takes curves with the same force as it does straightaways.

"We've used our racing experience on the track and adapted this technology in the engineering of the SR to create the ultimate street performance vehicle," said Steve Saleen, president and founder of Saleen Inc. "The SR goes from 0-60 mph 'very quickly' and hits a quarter mile speed 'very fast.'"

The 2002 SR is highlighted by Saleen's 5.8-liter Ford-based engine producing 505 hp and 500 lbs of torque mated to a Saleen six-speed transmission. A custom Saleen drive shaft leads to an IRS differential system at a gear ratio of 3.55:1. Braking is through 14.4" front rotors with four-piston calipers. Rear brakes are 13.0" metallic discs with four-piston calipers. Unibody construction features a complete roll cage and suspension reinforcement system. A refined Saleen Racecraft suspension includes independent uneven length double wishbones with Saleen N2 triple adjustable shocks and adjustable sway bars in the front and a Saleen-designed push-pull Independent rear suspension. The SR also includes power assisted rack and pinion steering. Additional features include race inspired seats and a white instrument gauge cluster with a 200 mph speedometer.

The Saleen SR boasts exterior aerodynamic refinements beyond the base complete body panels of the Saleen S281, including a specialty-designed composite hood, composite rear bodywork and underbody tunnel. The SR was wind-tunnel tuned at Lockheed-Martin's full-size tunnel in Marietta, Georgia. The SR comes standard with 18" wheels and Pirelli P-Zero tires. Every body part is unique to the Saleen SR, with the exception of the windows.

The Saleen SR is available as a coupe only. The retail price for the Saleen SR starts at $150,000. Like all Saleen vehicles, the 2002 SR is available only at Saleen Certified Ford Dealers nationwide.

Saleen manufacturing facilities include complete research, engineering, design and assembly capability. The Saleen SR meets all the same Federal government regulations as those of large automobile manufacturers, and come with a full factory warranty.

Since the company's inception in 1984, Saleen has produced over 9,000 vehicles, more than any other specialty manufacturer. The company's line includes Saleen Mustangs, and Saleen Performance Parts - a complete line of performance and appearance products for Mustangs.

John Lingenfelter. Nuff said.

[Panacea]

That's what I'm saying VTec, what's up with Ford and their numbers? $150,000 for 505 HP... You know what? I'll just spend that and get the Lingenfelter TT 800HP Corvette, with supsension mods, etc. 0-60 in 1.9 seconds, and (I BELIEVE) a 1/4 of 9-10 seconds... Nuff said!

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by Panacea
That's what I'm saying VTec, what's up with Ford and their numbers? $150,000 for 505 HP... You know what? I'll just spend that and get the Lingenfelter TT 800HP Corvette, with supsension mods, etc. 0-60 in 1.9 seconds, and (I BELIEVE) a 1/4 of 9-10 seconds... Nuff said!

There are videos of it going in the 1/4 at 8.98 I believe. Dunno what kind of tires tho.

[Panacea]

Meh, haven't seen that one. Just saw the segment on Motor Trend. But it'll kick that saleen's arse, no doubt about it.

[Greed4Speed]

For $150G you could get a Hennessey Motorsports Viper (Venom 500 or 600). They even have the Venom 1000 that can pump out 1123 RWHP. :wow:

http://www.hennesseyperformance.com/hennesseyperformance/Dyno.php?cart=BhirxRtD

[1993Grandamgt]

that Hennessey is bad a$$ my old boss trade his venom 750 for a Diablo SV........ dumb a$$!

[1993Grandamgt]

by the way there is one running around my hometown that was done by hennessey it has something like 850 horse then he went and put a 250 HP NOS kit on it.... awesome. its never been to the track but he loves messing with impo's especially RX7's and Supra TT's

[Licit]

Alot of which car you prefer comes down to what you like, and whether you are cheap like me. I honestly place a lower price over how the interior looks and suspension/steering performance. I mean Car and Driver dubbed the SVT a great car for someone that wants nice straight line speed. They probably should have mentioned that it also can be geared towards tight wads like myself that pinch pennies. And I would love an F-body, one of the nicest looking cars in my opinion is the WS-6 Firebird, I can't stop drooling over the hood design. I only have GM to thank that I can't buy one new any longer. The prices on used ones in Auto Trader are a little steep for the mileage usually. My biggest problem is that I was quoted a higher insurance price for an '00 Firebird than an '03 SVT Mustang. My insurance is through a private company so I can't say what another company would do, but thats a factor. On the issue of drag vs circuit racing they are quite different like Greed4Speed said. My personal high is way better though when I launch just right and accelerate at near perfect in a straight line. That's me, others may get their better buzz hitting the apex of a corner just right and coming out hard.

[Lash]

BENCH RACING IS GHEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



From my personal experience....(about 20 times at the track).....it seems that mustang owners have the hardest time pulling the 1/4 numbers that are expected of them. It's easy to say that a mustang SHOULD be in the 12's...it's another thing to ACTUALLY run it. Just tonight I saw mustangs with bolt-on's galore (even an '03 cobra) and a s/c '01 GT (most with drag's).........none of them broke into the 12's. On the other hand.......I saw a new stock Z-O6 run a 12.7 on street tires.

[1993Grandamgt]

very good point Lash..... the car is only as fast as the driver, as well as its traction limits.

[Jagey]

Why the hell is everything about straight line performance? How often do you seriously need that kind of crap anyways? You buy a car for everything it has to offer. The Corvette simply looks better, handles great, has some decent speed, has prestige, and EVERYONE turns to look at one. Most people wouldn't even care if a Cobra drove by because it resembles the crappy Mustangs too much. If you are paying that much money to drive in a straight line for about 12 seconds, and you are sacrificing everything else for it, that is when you know you are making stupid purchases and you are throwing your money around.

[95-GT]

Ok, now you say its a crappy mustang....when I've seen more vettes broken down in my area then stangs. I dont look at any vettes, cause i personally think they are ugly. And i loved watching the one get spanked all over the road by a svt earlier today...had to have about a 20 car lenth's on him. And plus with a stang, you can sit 2 more people then a corvette. You also say it looks better, but then again, it doesnt to me. Thats YOUR opinion and your implying that it overall looks better then the SVT for everyone. Go over to a mustang forums and tell them that...they will all say the svt is nicer - because your on a ford forum and not a gm forum. And how are you throwing your money around? You save $20k when you buy a mustang over a z06.

[Jagey]

Originally posted by 95-GT
Ok, now you say its a crappy mustang....when I've seen more vettes broken down in my area then stangs. I dont look at any vettes, cause i personally think they are ugly. And i loved watching the one get spanked all over the road by a svt earlier today...had to have about a 20 car lenth's on him. And plus with a stang, you can sit 2 more people then a corvette. You also say it looks better, but then again, it doesnt to me. Thats YOUR opinion and your implying that it overall looks better then the SVT for everyone. Go over to a mustang forums and tell them that...they will all say the svt is nicer - because your on a ford forum and not a gm forum. And how are you throwing your money around? You save $20k when you buy a mustang over a z06.

and you are talking about your area, what about the rest of the world. What about all those nasty 5.0's and those slow old ones. How about those older mustangs that got smoked by F-Bodys year after year? That is how the Corvette has the prestige, it never really had the horrible past the Mustang did. And come on, honestly, people really won't look twice at a Mustang. In all honestly, about 95 percent of car consumers won't be able to tell the difference between a stock Mustang and a Cobra Mustang without looking at the badges (including myself). I understand you are about speed and straight line performance, but where is that going to get you anyways, seriously. You are spending tonnes of money simply so you can drive it fast 12 seconds at a time, it literally isn't a smart way to spend money at all. That is just my opinion, we were both brought up in a different manor with different car people around us, so our opinions will always differ i suppose.

[Panacea]

OH yeah, so I guess saying my GA will spank a 78 or 79 mustang is fair? Just saying you saw a mustang beat a vette is nothing. How do you know the corvette was racing? How do you know the rust bucket didn't have any performance mods? So you see more vettes broken down than mustangs? So what? Maybe most of the people around you are too embarrased to drive a mustang, and are smart and get vettes. Maybe that's why you see so many broken down vettes. You're on a GM forum so what do you expect us to kiss your ass and bow down to the allugly mustang? What about throwing money around? I'd rather save up and buy a car that has all-round performance instead of straight line. At least in a vette I know I can go around a corner at high speeds and not have to worry about loosing control.

Remember, if your bucket 'o rust had the suspension system that the vette had, it'd be costing the same price!

Edit: A real car shouldn't be driven daily, or to get groceries. That's what the mustang's intended for, not the corvette. If I wanted a fast car to get my groceries, or pick the kids up from the school, etc. I would get a mustang...

[VTECSiGAH8R]

Originally posted by 95-GT
Ok, now you say its a crappy mustang....when I've seen more vettes broken down in my area then stangs. I dont look at any vettes, cause i personally think they are ugly. And i loved watching the one get spanked all over the road by a svt earlier today...had to have about a 20 car lenth's on him. And plus with a stang, you can sit 2 more people then a corvette. You also say it looks better, but then again, it doesnt to me. Thats YOUR opinion and your implying that it overall looks better then the SVT for everyone. Go over to a mustang forums and tell them that...they will all say the svt is nicer - because your on a ford forum and not a gm forum. And how are you throwing your money around? You save $20k when you buy a mustang over a z06.

The Cobra does look similar to the Mustang, but there is something about it besides the badges that lets me know, dunno how many other people can tell tho. But I must admit that I have a difficult time differentiationg between the 99+ Cobras and the '03 Cobra except for the blower whine.

As far as the backseats go, why even mention them? Ask any Mustang owner and they'll admit the seats are basically useless.

I think both cars are cool in all honesty, but with my family's past experience with Ford cars, we'll never own one again.

[Licit]

I was just on the lot looking at a few new SVT's and they still look sweet to me. Plus I could care less about people looking at me because I am in a Vette or whatever. That's a beef alot of people have is that you can see these wealthy 50 year old men driving on the weekends(slower than dripping molasses) in Vettes so the young girls will look at them. Now that's throwing money around, if somebody wants to drive that slow buy a Geo Metro, they 25mph in a 40mph zone just fine. As for straight line performance that is what most of this town is made of, not alot of curvy roads. Most SVT buyers/future buyers just don't want that interior/suspension for the extra cash, that's where I stand. I started this thread because of the whole "look at me" pricing on a Ferrari 575M which only runs 12's itself in the 1/4. Talk about throwing money around compare a new Z06 to the 575M and you see a $200,000 extra thrown down for a automakers damn name.

[1993Grandamgt]

the hood on the cobra does it for me! that with the front fascia!

[Panacea]

About the comment about driving slower. Perhaps they are smart enough not to race or speed in a residential area... :rolleyes:

[1993Grandamgt]

could possibly hopefully be! when we want to "Street Race" there is a privat road owned by a friend's family (owned and maintained by the family, not the boro, township, or state) we shut it down at both ends and race on that road (2 1/4 miles long)

[Panacea]

Must be nice... Could do a nice top end run on a stretch that long.

[1993Grandamgt]

yepp you can! great for drag racing. one time we put a 9 sec 85 GT stang against a kid who thought his 12 sec chevelle was the fastest car in the world! gee i wonder who won that race! lol but that stang was beaten by a NASTY Hyabussa (SP?)