First SE with DHP!!!

[kubiache]

It's in. Finally 3 months to day after I ordered it. Thanks a lot to Charles for getting it done, and putting up with my constant emails. I haven't got the CASE learn done yet because Chris White is busy with the Pontiac nationals, and 2 dealers I went to wanted $80 for it. So I'll wait until Chris gets back next week.
I only had to do the on/off security cycle once. the SES light is on. The SVS light came on once but went back off. Someone else mentioned they felt a hesitation from 1st to 2nd at WOT, I notice that too. Throttle response is TONS better. One difference I noticed between GTs and and my SE is that GTs have quicker throttle response when in motion. Not anymore! I haven't been on the highway to try out skipshift yet, though. I'm trying not to get too crazy with it until I get the CASE learn done, but once I do, I'll let everyone know how it's working.

[SikMindz]

Mmm...you're just itchin' to put me back in debt arent you?

[beyerch]

Dave,

99.999% chance that you will see two DTC's.

#1 will be for security passkey incorrect. However, this is normal and you just clear it after the relearn is finished. If you check the status of the error, it currently passes, but failed in history, etc....

#2 - could possibly be for Crank Position Variation not learned. You need the case learn.

Shifting will take some time to solidfy completely as there are things to be learned, etc. Let me know if you still experience it after a few days.


P.S. I had a 99 SE over tonight and there's now one 99 SE dhp floating around as well...... Assuming I have some time in the next week or two, we can probably knock 00,02, and possibly 03 out shortly.

Thanks

Charles

[PontiacGT2K]

Beyerch: I'll be willing to do the "prototype" '00 Grand Am Se...heh. Seriously though, how much for reprogrammed pcm for my '00 GT?

[kubiache]

Originally posted by SikMindz
Mmm...you're just itchin' to put me back in debt arent you?

I do what I can. :D

Charles: There's no potential damage I could be causing by not getting the relearn done until Chris gets back next week is there? If there is, I can always put the old one back in until then...unless you're trip to Canada was via Grand Rapids. ;) JK. I've got two more places to try and get it done tomorrow.

Pontiac: Check out PFYC, 99-02 GTs is already there.

[PontiacGT2K]

I know...but he lives near me. Hoping I could either get a dyno tune in 2 months (after other things go on) or at least be able to customize it a bit to my liking. And save on shipping....yup.

[Avsguy01]

No 2003 GT chip yet?

[KtuluCrazyTrain]

I was at Charles's house last night and he hooked up the DHP. No more DRL's anymore either. :) So far so good, but the comp. is still learning so shifts aren't as good as they will be yet. I've got a problem with it that needs to be attended to but once that's fixed I'll know for sure how it is. Thanks again Charles.

[PontiacGT2K]

Grrr....I want this kit!

[KtuluCrazyTrain]

Kubiache, when did you install yours?

[kubiache]

Originally posted by KtuluCrazyTrain
Kubiache, when did you install yours?

I put mine in bright and early Wednesday morning, then drove around town in my quest to find someone with a Tech II that didn't want a rediculous amount of money to do the relearn.

[KtuluCrazyTrain]

Damn, guess I'll have to settle for 2nd SE, but first 99. :thumbs:

[claymore]

Originally posted by KtuluCrazyTrain
Damn, guess I'll have to settle for 2nd SE, but first 99. :thumbs:


youll have competition . :D

kubiache: I'm glad to see you finally got it in after all the hoopla with the pfyc mix up.

:thumbs:

alas, I, and many other SE owners, must wait longer

[beyerch]

Just to clarify this was NOT a mixup with PFYC, it was purely a DHP mixup. I gave them the wrong info for their site! However, soon it will be correct info. :thumbs:

Charles


Originally posted by claymore
youll have competition . :D

kubiache: I'm glad to see you finally got it in after all the hoopla with the pfyc mix up.

:thumbs:

alas, I, and many other SE owners, must wait longer

[kubiache]

Charles, did you catch my question?

Originally posted by kubiache
Charles: There's no potential damage I could be causing by not getting the relearn done until Chris gets back next week is there? If there is, I can always put the old one back in until then...unless you're trip to Canada was via Grand Rapids. ;) JK. I've got two more places to try and get it done tomorrow.


Also, I got a taste of the skipshift tonight, pretty freakin sweet, and frankly, scared the hell out of me at first. The 1-2 shift still delays a little, though.

last thing to try will be seeing exactly how fast my car can go. :thumbs:

[iceman]

Originally posted by kubiache
Charles, did you catch my question?



Also, I got a taste of the skipshift tonight, pretty freakin sweet, and frankly, scared the hell out of me at first. The 1-2 shift still delays a little, though.

last thing to try will be seeing exactly how fast my car can go. :thumbs:

yeah, skipshift is kinda neato..

hey Charles what's up with my SES ????

[MSJHWT]

*Ears perk up* **Soon** it will be correct info? **Digs into wallett** I want one!

[kubiache]

So my car sucks or something.
Got the CASE learn done. Went to the track. Sounds like a good idea right? Let's go through my last 3 times at the track:
SLP only = 15.64
add CAI = 15.72
add DHP = 15.80
I don't get it. The second I can blame on Milan, but tonight was at a good track.
The shifting is still way off. 1-2 and 2-3 both hesitate and shift too high. At anything other than 3/4+ throttle, the shift is great, but I didn't buy it to drive slow with hard shifts.
Any ideas? I gotta write Charles tomorrow.

[iceman]

Having any traction problems ??

[beyerch]

no need to write me, I'm right here! :)

1/4 mile times alone do not tell any type of a story.

What we need are relative weather conditions between the runs, track conditions, and slip information such as 60', 1/8 mile & mph, 1/4 mile & mph, etc.

Those times are all very close to one another so it wouldn't take much to affect the outcome. Give us some real data and we'll try to figure it out.

charles


Originally posted by kubiache
So my car sucks or something.
Got the CASE learn done. Went to the track. Sounds like a good idea right? Let's go through my last 3 times at the track:
SLP only = 15.64
add CAI = 15.72
add DHP = 15.80
I don't get it. The second I can blame on Milan, but tonight was at a good track.
The shifting is still way off. 1-2 and 2-3 both hesitate and shift too high. At anything other than 3/4+ throttle, the shift is great, but I didn't buy it to drive slow with hard shifts.
Any ideas? I gotta write Charles tomorrow.

[Kdawg207]

I'd love to know when the DHP for the 03 GT will be available

[Avsguy01]

Yeah ive mentioned that numerous times. It seems to be taking a really long time to calibrate the 03's

[beyerch]

Originally posted by Avsguy01
Yeah ive mentioned that numerous times. It seems to be taking a really long time to calibrate the 03's

i don't have anything done for '03s...... for any car.... we're working through 03 grand prix now; however.

charles

[iceman]

How about a cal that fixes my 02 problem.. I heard now I'm not the only one with it.

[Kdawg207]

Originally posted by beyerch
we're working through 03 grand prix now; however.

charles

That wont exactly help me
But i'll keep waitin for it

[kubiache]

Ok, here's more track info:
the 1st posted time (15.64) was probably 60 degrees w/ low humidity.
Don't worry about the second, Milan doesn't count.
The 3rd (15.80) was closer to 80 degrees w/ 100% humidity.
Now if I'm wrong about this I apologize wholeheartedly to Charles for immediately freaking out, but 20 degrees shouldn't cost me half a second should it?
I got my best 60' of 2.30 at my last trip. Traction has been fine, and it feels like I'm launching well. When it drops into 2nd and third, it pulls really hard, but it takes too long to make that shift.

[iceman]

How many miles you have with the new pcm ??

At least you have traction.. thats something I definitely don't have

[armith]

As for 20 degrees and humidity making a half second.. no it shouldn't.. your numbers only show .16 of a difference.. from my experience 20 degrees will make that kind of difference.. and the humidity will most definately make a difference... Try running on 87 degree day with 100% humidity and running at best a 16.44 with a GT.. and then on a 80 degree day with lower humidity and running 16.1.

what was worse is that I was running 2.30 and 2.28 60s when I was running 16.4s... I was getting real solid launchs and from the 1000 ft on I fell flat. My 16.1s were all 2.4 and 2.5 60s.. it was just different track conditions.. weak launches but I wasn't falling flat till well after the 1/8 miles mark.

Ask Schweppe23 20+ degree temp differences and different track conditions can do to a 14.9 car. It'll make ya want to sell it or just strike a match. Sounds like its time to have some fun on the dyno.. With that and maybe some tweaking I'll bet you'll be back to your old numbers or quicker in no time. :cheers:

[kubiache]

Originally posted by iceman
How many miles you have with the new pcm ??

At least you have traction.. thats something I definitely don't have

I put about 400 miles on before the CASE learn, then another 400 miles after the CASE learn before going to the track.

How long did it take anyone else for the shift hesitation to go away?

[H.O. Driver]

Has to be something witht he gearing on it. If the cal is for the GT trans instead of the SE trans it will shift like a monkey farting in a tuba! lol It should be all taken care of once we get some cold weather though. I will be guning for you at MGM 4 Dave! :thumbs:

[The Old Guy]

Originally posted by beyerch
no need to write me, I'm right here! :)

1/4 mile times alone do not tell any type of a story.

What we need are relative weather conditions between the runs, track conditions, and slip information such as 60', 1/8 mile & mph, 1/4 mile & mph, etc.

Those times are all very close to one another so it wouldn't take much to affect the outcome. Give us some real data and we'll try to figure it out.

charles

I've ben running at the track for most of my life, which is why I always laugh when people try to compare time slips from different days, track, parts of the country etc.

I normally run at the same track every Wednesday, so I should always be prety close to the same times...right??? In a perfect world that would be true, but I have slips that range from 15.6 all the way up to 16.5.

As Charles said, you need to compare times at every mark, 60, 330,1/8th, 1000, 1/4th.....and not by time slip to time slip, but the difference in the 330 to the 1/8th, and the difference in the 60 to the 330 and so on. Then tack on about .05 or better seconds slower for every 10% humidity increase.

What you need to do is go to someone at the track that goes all the time, ask him what he usually runs and how he's running that night, or run against somone that you have run against before and take it from there. Then take into account that although the car has adjusted to the mods, you may not have.....

[kubiache]

Thank you, Tom. Point taken. Here's a rundown of my best ever and my best last night, both at Stanton.
May .................................................. Yesterday
60 deg, low humidity ........................ 80 degrees, 100% humidity

60' ..... 2.341 ....................................... 2.304
330 .... 6.607 ....................................... 6.632
1/8 ..... 10.111 ..................................... 10.202
MPH .. 70.89 ....................................... 69.75
1000 .. 13.102 ..................................... 13.229
1/4 ..... 15.648 ..................................... 15.803
MPH ... 87.78 ..................................... 85.34

Once more, the time on the left is SLP only, and on the right adds CAI and DHP.

Thanks guys for any help.

[The Old Guy]

You know Dave, I don't think I'd get too upset with those times yet. When I look at the numbers and do a comparison, you only lost .155 over all. It's spred across the entire 1/4, not in any one place, so the car is running smoothly across the power band.

I've lost as much as .3 seconds due to humidity. An example is last night. A friend with a bone stock Alero that normally runs 15.9s was running 16.4s last night. When we compared our time slips, I was running about .5 seconds faster than him all night, but I've run as low as 15.6 with just a CAI and exhaust.

If you could get a hook and get your 60 down to a 2.2 or a 2.1 you'd have been at 15.7 or 15.6 last night, which I would gladly take on a night with 100% humidity!!!

Hang in there, Bud...it'll get better!!:thumbs:

[armith]

those numbers still look like a matter of track and/or weather conditions... you figure average fair humidity in may is probably what 60% maybe 70%.... and 60 degrees out.. "Realistically" with exhaust and CAI you should see 3 or 4 tenths gain.. Maybe more in cool weather...

DHP supposed to help with maybe another tenth or on a moderately modded car.. so seeing 15.5 to 15.7 on average should be fair to expect...average...

Now go by Old Guys estimates.. Just the humidity alone about 2 tenths of a second off your best. tack on 20 degrees.. warmer air going plus the probably added 35 degrees of track surface temp.. Now you have a slightly slower track, and the car will run a shade leaner because the hotter air coming in..

On the flip side.. Should you still be seeing 15.7s and 15.8s say by late october or so when its back to lower humidity and 60 again.. Then there may be some concern.

You can tell me to stick it if you'd like.. but I have spent a considerable amount of time at different tracks this year and have had the priviledge to talk with a lot of different people about these sorts of things..

I do hope the shifting thing gets sorted out for ya and who knows.. maybe in the fall I'll come up and run against ya. :thumbs:

**steps down from soap box**

[kubiache]

oops, I realized it says 0 degrees in the left column. I changed that to 60 degrees.

Thanks, Tom (and armith, too) for responding. It helps to hear from someone with 30+ years experience.

[SikMindz]

Well keep us updated...still collecting funds but I need to see some hard evidence even as appealing as it is now. Hopefully you'll see some better track times! I'm still hoping to get some comparison times with my new 62mm TB and ported UIM!

[resevil83]

oh and I hope you don't run on a full tank of gas... When I go to the track I run a 16.1 with a full tank with a little bit left bout a quarter tank you could see me running 15.7's. This is not 100 percent prooved... but it will be soon.

[H.O. Driver]

Most liquids, water, gas, 1 gallon = about 7 lbs.
It would make a big difference, 10 gallons = about 70lbs.

[The Old Guy]

Originally posted by H.O. Driver
Most liquids, water, gas, 1 gallon = about 7 lbs.
It would make a big difference, 10 gallons = about 70lbs.

You also have to take into account that the weight is not stationary. If you figure the rearward force of the gas sloshing to the back of the tank that increases. Maybe one of the mathematicians on here can come up with what the weight could be.

I don't know exactly how much faster you'd be ....full tank vs. 1/4, but it has to have some effect.

[SikMindz]

I've tried on a nearly empty tank once and on a close to full and the difference was an average of .2 seconds. Driving/track conditions were similar both times.

[Dr_Kyle]

your 60' was better but the rest were worse. I'm leaning towards the shifting problem. That's just my $.02

[The Old Guy]

Originally posted by Dr_Kyle
your 60' was better but the rest were worse. I'm leaning towards the shifting problem. That's just my $.02

I dunno man, you may be right, but I've had the weather kick my butt on more than one occasion. The bad thing about it is the fact that this is a new mod so he doesn't have enough of a baseline to determine anything yet. The ideal situation would be to dyno it and then you'd know for sure. I say give it another shot on a cool night before he hits the panic button.

I'm still thinking that a custom tune on the PCM may be the best route to go.

[Dr_Kyle]

Oh, there's no doubt that the weather didn't help, but he added the CAI and the DHP so he should've at least run closer times. It's like you said though, not enough baseline to give an accurate diagnosis.

[kubiache]

As far as you guys mentioning how much gas I had, in May IIRC, I had about 1/4 tank. This week the minute I pulled away from the track the gas light came on. So liquid weight wasn't an issue. I'm just going to keep my eyes on the weather. I've always got Wednesdays off, and that's test and tune night, so I can pretty much drop everything and go for a few hours.
Before then, however, I'm going to see how long it takes the car to overcome this shifting issue.