Cold start issues- Electrical Reset [Archive] - GrandAmGT.com Forum

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SikMindz
12-27-2007, 02:05 PM
Yeah yeah...I've searched and haven't found anything similar and am tired of looking through the diff. threads. Here's the low down-

Just recently as the temps started dipping in the 30-40s at night I've been having the weirdest of starting problems. In the mornings I'll put the key in, the gauge lights will check in and out, fuel pump will prime as usual and the car will seem fine. However when I try to crank it over it will do one of two things:

1) Crank over (after giving it some gas- yes I know it's bad but sometimes it will be the only way to get it going right away) and then die a second later. When turning the key back to off and letting it sit there w/o even powering on all the gauges will go nuts and my HU will reset.

2) Do nothing. No crank or clicking from the starter. All lights/electrical will turn off immediately. When it is keyed back to off the gauges will all go nuts w/o lighting up and the HU will reset.

Today (as any good GA owner would do) I got out of the shook the battery around and cursed the GA to its grave. And lo and behold, I got back in and the car turned over a second later.

I have an Optima Red Top and a HO alternator. I don't have any other electrical issues besides the occasional ABS light popping on and this seems unrelated. Anyone have any suggestions on what it might be? ;crap

First Sik's mom joke in this thread gets automatic warning points for post whoring.

timka86
12-27-2007, 03:03 PM
have you ever had any security light issues? you may consider that it may be the passlock crapping out.

although it doesn't sound like the passlock, i think it's a short somewhere in your ignition switch. when you start the car the gauges flop from one side to the other, well if they're going crazy something is shorting the wire that make's them flop. and it could be dying cuz the ignition wires in the switch are making a bad connection.

anyway, try cleaning out the ignitions switch, electrical aerosol cleaner, wd-40 - compressed air..

doesn't sound like it's the battery or alternator. could be bad/rusted ground...

SikMindz
12-27-2007, 03:11 PM
I'll have to check the grounds and look for corroded terminals when I'm back from a biz trip thru the weekend.

My security light is permanently on as the ignition cylinder has been plagued with issues for quite some while now. The indicator light has been on a permanent basis for the last year or so and I haven't had any issues to the last 2 weeks or so.

The weirdest part of it all is how my HU will shut off and reset. It's a good thing I don't ever use the radio or having to reset the presets would be a PITA.

Sprucegagt
12-27-2007, 04:15 PM
I'd have the battery and connections checked. Your head unit wouldn't be shutting off if it was a local ground issue.

*siksmom*

Mike Jung
12-27-2007, 04:28 PM
I would guess:

Battery connections


Battery


Alternator


My main suspect would be the car battery needs changing.

SikMindz
12-27-2007, 04:29 PM
Good point.

Fockin' clownshoes. I can't give other mods warning pts. :angry:

I would guess:

Battery connections


Battery


Alternator


My main suspect would be the car battery needs changing.

I don't know. Everything electrical in the car works fine and I'm seeing no loss of power anywhere even at idle.

Where are all the grounds I should be checking?

Sprucegagt
12-27-2007, 08:14 PM
There are 2 main ground points. One is on the engine block, it's a bell housing bolt that secures one part of the - battery cable. The other point is behind the battery were the other wire from the - cable is secured by a bolt to the chassis. I would make sure that both connections are clean with bare metal to metal contact and tight.

You mom says "Hi". Don't worry, I'll be sure to kick her out sometime before daylight. *siksmom*

cardude007617
12-27-2007, 09:34 PM
ya it does sound like a battery issue. maybe a slow drain at night and it leaves the car with JUST enough to get it started (hence the HU resetting due to a dead battery...) ? i dont know...... or is it damp out? maybe some battery connections are funny with the dampness?

SikMindz
12-28-2007, 03:31 AM
Not just the HU. Double checked and my odo is resetting too. Probably a bad connection somewhere.

Goddamn GA.

SikMindz
01-08-2008, 01:37 AM
Still having the same issues but now when I get it cranked over I sometimes have to blip the gas or the car stalls out. Fuel pump is less than 1.5 years old, no codes and the filter was replaced within the last 1.5 years as well.

Visually inspected all grounds and terminals and everything seems intact.

It ONLY has starting issues when the car sits for longer than a few hours and gets cold which is the weird thing.

I'm inclined to say it's related to the ignition cylinder because the SECURITY light has been on permanently for about a year now- I think there's a short somewhere.

Regardless I'm tired of hunting for the issue so I'm taking it into my mechanic tomorrow.

Let it be known that the GA will be gone before the end of 2008 if not sooner. :(

AleroME
01-08-2008, 02:14 AM
starter is crapping out is my guess.

Mine went last month. When i went to start the car, the car would try to start then nothing. Watched my voltmeter go from 12.4 to 6.6 every time i went to start. Then It blew my ignition fuse, replaced starter and all fine.

My starter was shorting out internally. It still spun like normal, but after 1 second, it'd not do anything like froze up. then it was draining my batt to blow the ign. fuse. Mine would do this at every startup.

Is your cold start problem only at cold start? or does it go away when the engine is warmed up? If it goes away at warmed up then i dunno. But starter is my guess.

SikMindz
01-08-2008, 03:13 AM
starter is crapping out is my guess.

Mine went last month. When i went to start the car, the car would try to start then nothing. Watched my voltmeter go from 12.4 to 6.6 every time i went to start. Then It blew my ignition fuse, replaced starter and all fine.

My starter was shorting out internally. It still spun like normal, but after 1 second, it'd not do anything like froze up. then it was draining my batt to blow the ign. fuse. Mine would do this at every startup.

Is your cold start problem only at cold start? or does it go away when the engine is warmed up? If it goes away at warmed up then i dunno. But starter is my guess.

It could be as that was my initial thought. But it doesn't explain the reset of my HU or odometer when the car doesnt kick over.

Generally (and I have no clue whether or not I'm even close to being right) if the starter was going bad I'd at least get a click or two when I tried to crank it over, right? The only reason why I think it's something else is because I won't get a response period. It'll be key in, ON, fuel pump prime, light cycle, turn to start then nothing. All power is killed.

It's not only at cold start but the problem is more evident and predictable in the mornings. It does seem to get better if I've driven around for awhile and the engine temp is up though which is odd.

;crap

Sprucegagt
01-08-2008, 06:24 AM
Are both battery terminals tight?

WeibSunder
01-08-2008, 06:56 AM
Are both battery terminals tight?

That's what I would recommend. When I was having similar troubles I took the battery back to walmart and they inspected it and said that the terminal had broke off inside the battery case probably due to over tightening. But I had a 1 year warranty and they gave me another for free. Hope that helps.

AleroME
01-08-2008, 11:09 AM
It could be as that was my initial thought. But it doesn't explain the reset of my HU or odometer when the car doesnt kick over.

Generally (and I have no clue whether or not I'm even close to being right) if the starter was going bad I'd at least get a click or two when I tried to crank it over, right? The only reason why I think it's something else is because I won't get a response period. It'll be key in, ON, fuel pump prime, light cycle, turn to start then nothing. All power is killed.

It's not only at cold start but the problem is more evident and predictable in the mornings. It does seem to get better if I've driven around for awhile and the engine temp is up though which is odd.

;crap


OK then its the ignition cylinder most likely. My friend co-worker just had his replaced on his 2003 GA. put the key in "position" and it works, then goto start.. gets nothing. His security was on and all. He said it costed 95 bucks to fix at the dealer. but had to get towed there. good thing for AAA.

But his HU and trip meter don't reset though. So your problem is wierd. LOL

SikMindz
01-08-2008, 12:08 PM
Are both battery terminals tight?

Both are secure and tight.

That's what I would recommend. When I was having similar troubles I took the battery back to walmart and they inspected it and said that the terminal had broke off inside the battery case probably due to over tightening. But I had a 1 year warranty and they gave me another for free. Hope that helps.

I don't know if that's the case but I'm sure my mechanic will look into it. I don't think that's the case because like I mentioned earlier the car always has power until I crank that like Soulja Boy. I would think that if the terminals were loose or had broken off I'd have the same symptoms as a dying battery (interior lights not turning on, gauges/HVAC lighting low, etc.). Who knows... :(

OK then its the ignition cylinder most likely. My friend co-worker just had his replaced on his 2003 GA. put the key in "position" and it works, then goto start.. gets nothing. His security was on and all. He said it costed 95 bucks to fix at the dealer. but had to get towed there. good thing for AAA.

But his HU and trip meter don't reset though. So your problem is wierd. LOL

Hopefully it'll be that simple. Maybe it's a culmination of all the above.

Regardless the car went in for electrical diagnostics and to see how bad the LIM leak is (as the car has been kicking out coolant lately on a regular basis). Will have both addressed and will most likely throwing it on the chopping block after I figure out other finances and what I can afford to replace it.

Keep the suggestions coming in though so I can give my mechanic some ideas if he can't find anything. He keyed into everything everyone already mentioned as soon as I described the problem, but just in case...

Thanks all!

SikMindz
01-08-2008, 04:47 PM
Reporting back in as I heard from the mechanic.

All electrical and starter issues are apparently related to the stupid LIM. The leak is apparently at the point that the system cannot create a seal at startup thus causing a) no start b) stalling out. Strange explanation to me, but I'll get further details tomorrow after it's fixed. All grounds, terminals and wires were found to be at the right voltage and no shorts were found.

Gawd this car blows. But hey- if I can fix two birds with one expensive stone I'm all for it.

Mendoza
01-08-2008, 05:04 PM
I'm willing to bet it's a passlock 2 issue. Resistance in the key cylinder changes when the weather drops below the 50's. Thats why when we install car starters at my shop we never use resistors to bypass the passlock system. They just always seem to go bad. Try this it's called a 15 min passlock relearn. Insert key and turn to the on postion the security light should start blinking leave it sit there for 15-20mins. The light should stay on solid then turn the car off then start it. If the security light does not reset and go away then you have a problem with the passlock/ignition cylinder. Is there any type of car starter/alarm on the vehicle? I doubt it since your a cali boy but it's worth a shot. Also you can bypass your security system with the resistors if your looking for a cheap quick fix. Any local car audio shop should know what i'm talking about. Hope that helps

Oh ya forgot to mention when the passlock system is acting up your car will start then die just like what your describing.

SikMindz
01-08-2008, 05:13 PM
Like I mentioned the SECURITY light is permanently on and has been for about a year now IIRC. I'm sure there is a problem with the ignition cylinder but honestly having the security light on permanently has been a blessing- I can't even count how many times I've tripped the Passlock 2 when it was working and had to wait around until it reset. Whatever is causing it to be permanently on, has allowed me to not have to worry about it.

No starter/alarm on the car.

Sprucegagt
01-09-2008, 06:35 AM
Reporting back in as I heard from the mechanic.

All electrical and starter issues are apparently related to the stupid LIM. The leak is apparently at the point that the system cannot create a seal at startup thus causing a) no start b) stalling out. Strange explanation to me, but I'll get further details tomorrow after it's fixed. All grounds, terminals and wires were found to be at the right voltage and no shorts were found.

Gawd this car blows. But hey- if I can fix two birds with one expensive stone I'm all for it.

I'm not buying this explaination unless he is saying the car is hydrolocking due to the LIM leak. But if that was the case then you couldn't keep coolant in the car at all.

WeibSunder
01-09-2008, 06:51 AM
When the posts had broken off inside the battery case all my gauges would come on, stereo would play or sometimes it would just kick the disk out and it would always reset my preset radio stations and EQ's and all that jazz. That's the way I knew it was a battery issue. But sometimes I would turn the key with everything electronic working and it would just click and everything would turn back off.

Mendoza
01-09-2008, 07:44 AM
Security light being stuck on is never a blessing you should never trigger the passlock system by accident unless you are trying to hot wire the car. Get the passlock checked.

SikMindz
01-11-2008, 02:02 PM
I'm not buying this explaination unless he is saying the car is hydrolocking due to the LIM leak. But if that was the case then you couldn't keep coolant in the car at all.

I wasn't keeping coolant in the car. I was refilling the reservoir at least every other day for the past week or two.

Regardless I didn't have time to chat with him. Probably early next week I'll get a chance to see exactly what the issue was.

They reset the security light and the car seems to be starting everytime after the fix.

Who knows.

Still for sale soon.

SikMindz
01-11-2008, 08:31 PM
Started again right away tonight sitting in the rain most of the day.

Apparenly the LIM repair fixed all the problems?

WTF?

SikMindz
01-23-2008, 11:38 AM
Update:

Car was having stalling issues again at idle when cold (or so it seems). Finally threw a code and found out the crank sensor was out of whack. Had it replaced but then the car started stalling out still until the engine was heated up. Going to try and replace the coolant temp plug this afternoon and see if that may be the issue.

$%$#^@%

Lab Rat
01-23-2008, 12:26 PM
I think you need to do a case learn after a CPS. Did the dealer replace it?

SikMindz
01-23-2008, 02:12 PM
I hope there wasn't a reflash. Totally slipped my mind.

My mechanic did it. We'll see later.