seeking Tuning help with my cam

[geldartb]

ok well today i got it to idle and run for an extended period of time but its still sitting rich.

i have a bunch of scans from today and the bin file for the car im posting up. so here i am to pick the tuning guru's brains for some area that i have overlooked.

i got a bunch of small scans mostly when i was trying to find a good idle, so if you wanna see more let me know and ill post them up.

its running rich and runs rough(ie not assoc with the roughness of the cam)

specs of the car
1357 cam from wot-tech detailed specs for cam (http://wot-tech.com/shop/images/Cam/60V6regrinds.htm)
INT 230 EXH 236 @.050
112 LSA
515 INT 515 EXH lift at 1.6.1

ported 3400 upper and lower
65mm throttlebody
28lb series 1 3800 injectors

[Shock24Z]

http://scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5337

Your LTFT's are very high positives indicating a lean condition, not a rich one. Your IAC counts for a couple different areas in the scan are very low or at 0. That right there screams vacuum leak to me.

If you just put this thing back together, thats probably what it is.

Also, increasing MAF values will add fuel, making it more rich. But thats okay, because it was running lean anyways...

Edit: Looked through your bin. Put the timing cells below 1000 back to stock. That will make goofy things happen at idle. I hope that was done in an effort to fix this, otherwise that could be part of the problem...

[geldartb]

been back together for awhile, just low on time sometimes to tinker with it.

dont know about the iac counts, its got normal numbers then goes 0. all the gaskets are new could be the rubber grommets going into the plenum.

[3x3]

For the rpm that it's hitting at idle and the MAF readings being low I would say that you have a leak somewhere? Looking at the MAF numbers it looks like you should be idling around 750 - 775 rpm but it's hitting 1100 to 1200 rpm. I'll take a look at your file tomorrow.

[geldartb]

heres my latest round of info from last friday. all new gaskets and basicly new sensors including an O2 and IAC which i put in last week. the UIM and throttlebody gaskets are no more than 1 month old if that. ive gone over everything a billion times. with the cam theres no way this thing will idle less than 950 anything lower and its gonna have crap for vac at idle and lope like a mofo like it already doesnt.
ok got some scans from today this is after a new O2 sensor and IAC sensor. but now im getting weird or are these normal numbers for the iac counts, im used to them being much lower and not in the mid 100's-200's.

it idled with my help it seems to want to hang down low below 800 and lower, and none of the idle numbers are below 950.

the fueling still sucks even with swapped injectors, same injector just a diff set. this thing wont idle for ****.

heres the first scan
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5403

heres the second one
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5402

heres the third
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5401

and while doing the second scan i got some DTC codes here they are
DTC CODES Reader (Beta, expect issues)
------------------------------
Detecting Vehicle Modules : START
-- Module B060 Unknown! Sorry!
-- PCM/ECM Module Detected!
-- BCM Module Detected!
-- Module 106A Unknown! Sorry!
-- Module 2860 Unknown! Sorry!
-- IPC (Instrument Panel Cluster) Module Detected!
Detecting Vehicle Modules : DONE

-- BCM DTC Detecting
-- BCM DTC COUNT SET HEX :: 07006CF140590800
-- BCM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF14059000000
-- BCM DTC CODES ENDED
-- BCM DTC Count : 0

-- PCM/ECM DTC Detecting
-- PCM/ECM DTC COUNT SET HEX :: 07006CF110590803
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF110590101FF
DTC Code : P0101
Description : Mass Air Flow (MAF) Sensor Performance
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF11059110619
DTC Code : P1106
Description : Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) Sensor Circuit Intermittent High Voltage
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF11059162619
DTC Code : P1626
Description : Theft Deterrent Fuel Enable Signal Not Received
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF110590000FF
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODES ENDED
-- PCM/ECM DTC Count : 3

-- IPC DTC Detecting
-- IPC DTC COUNT SET HEX :: 07006CF160590800
-- IPC DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF16059000000
-- IPC DTC CODES ENDED
-- IPC DTC Count : 0

shouldnt get the theft fuel code but it never came back so.
and the maf might have came on when it idled real low for a bit.

seriously any help would be greatly appreciated. i must be looking at the wrong thing or something cause this thing is driving me bat**** insane.

checked all the hoses and there all good so no there should be no vac leak and the gaskets are all new.

[3x3]

Raise your injector flow rate to 292.85 across all kpa's. I would also make the IAC Idle calibration all 950.

[geldartb]

ok ill do that and let you know friday how it works out.

i put the 292.85 into the file and when i close it to save it, it transforms it to 292.9 close enough i guess.

[geldartb]

well after i found out the TPS on the car was junk and swapped in another one i got it running and idling around 1k which is normal and stable.

heres a scan from today's run
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5439

its got a hiccup/skip if i let the car free roll with my foot off the gas, almost like its gasping for air, but i find that hard to believe since the car has been run before with the tps volts setup like this.

also the LTFT's are still ridiculous high on the lean side.

[Shock24Z]

its got a hiccup/skip if i let the car free roll with my foot off the gas, almost like its gasping for air

That would point towards the IAC. I would check/replace that next.

Also in my opinion its best to leave the injector flow rate tables as close to what the injectors actually flow as possible. There are different ways of tuning though... I'm just not an advocate of that method.

[geldartb]

That would point towards the IAC. I would check/replace that next.

Also in my opinion its best to leave the injector flow rate tables as close to what the injectors actually flow as possible. There are different ways of tuning though... I'm just not an advocate of that method.

already did that the IAC is brand new. this was prob the 2nd time i ran it. ill find the receipt and bring it back to try another one,

[3x3]

Didn't you change up your MAF tables prior to the changes I suggested with the IFR? The PCM is commanding fuel to be taken out now. Also where did you get your original tables for 28lbs injectors?

[geldartb]

i used the calculation 19.5/28 and then went into dhp selected the whole table and hit percent typed in 69.6 and got the number i was using.

i only upped the maf 5% in the lower half say from 4000 down to the beginning 1600. then i went back to stock since the 5% wasn't giving ma any reults

yeah i used the ifr you suggested for the last round of data. didnt change anything else all the rest is stock.

[Shock24Z]

280mS/g = 28.3lb/hr

292mS/g = 27.1lb/hr

I'd stick with the 280mS/g

Have you tried a MAF tune? Can't hurt to try.

This tool will help you: http://theblattners.com/projects/tablemodifier/Default.html

See http://wiki.opentuner3800.com/index.php?title=Tuning_Your_MAF_Table for more info.

On the timeline of events, when did it start running crappy? After modifications of any sort or just out of the blue?

edit for links

[geldartb]

it ran fine the first time i drove it aside from the rust on the rotors it ran and drive fine, then it fouled the plugs.

couple weeks after that it wouldnt even idle by itself, then it o2 sensor took a dump which i think it was bad all along.

replaced the o2 then noticed the crappy iac counts so that got replaced and after that the car wouldnt idel without my help so out of random i swapped the tps and it worked fine.

it sort of just happens to run crappy. i get a day of running good and then next week it wont run for crap.

id have to say right after it fouled the plugs its just been a snowball effect of problems, and i havent even changed anything on the car.

would i be able to get a MAF tune from the data i got. id love to get some data to get a MAF tune but up until last week the car pretty much wasn't drivable.

Both of the links dont work you posted. its been awhile but the maf tune is the part where i dont unplug the maf right.

ive been trying all this time to keep the car happy and get it running good so i can get a sticker

[geldartb]

well took it to get some gas got some good runs about 8 miles worth of data logged in 3 seperate scans though.

first one is till i got to the gas station
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5463

second one isnt that long about a few minutes but its from the gas station to a road where i stopped to check things
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5464

third is from the spot i stopped at back to my garage,
http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=5465

all in all it ran alright for the drive, still has the skip when you let off the gas and let it coast and now it wants to run at 500-600 rpms even when theres nothing below 975 in the rpm chart.
it ran decent for the drive but now it wont even idle and runs like shiot now.

i went through the whole top end today and checked everything over and all the gaskets and plastic tubes were good no leaks. so whats causing it to run like shiot.

these are the codes i keep getting but there not the same parts as last time.
DTC Code : P0101
Description : Mass Air Flow (MAF) Sensor Performance
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF11059010829
DTC Code : P0108
Description : Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) Sensor Circuit High Voltage
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF11059110639
DTC Code : P1106
Description : Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) Sensor Circuit Intermittent High Voltage
-- PCM/ECM DTC CODE DATA HEX :: 08006CF11059162619
DTC Code : P1626
this site explains it pretty good
http://www.obd-codes.com/p0101

[geldartb]

well i found a nice vac leak due to un-level intake spacers which cracked the uim along with the un-level surface created a nice vac leak.

found this all with my handy propane torch minus the flame. started over by the maf and slowly worked my way over to the alternator and bam once i got to the runner by the alt the idle spiked.

[Shock24Z]

Nice. That was starting to bother me. It didn't make any sense to me to say that it wasn't a vacuum leak.

edit: on that note, I would say around 90% of idling issues I've come across are indeed vacuum leaks. So for future reference to whoever reads this... look long and hard for a leak.

[geldartb]

i went over every hose a million times and every gasket too and when everytime they came back good and new it was starting to bother me.

once i hit that corner with the propane i knew i had it. i most likely wouldnt have found that without the propane

starting to bother you, can you imagine how it was bothering me. i was going insane, im like wtf it worked fine before now what the hell.

well we will see friday when i swap my last spare uim on minus the spacers. hopefully fingers crossed it will be good to go.

this was also screwing with the shifting on my transmission. rolling to a stop and then starting again it had some nice hesitation.