Milzy Motorsports headers with PICTURES!

[slw240sx]

Originally Posted by trewyn15

I agree with you, they probably did put more time into their headers than any other brand out there, but if there's no performance gain there what's the point, I feel like it would be cheaper to fix up the pacesetters or S&S which seem like an awesome deal. Idk, I wish someone had either of the headers and upgraded to Milzy and could let us know.

I also agree, I don't think Mike will do the dyno pull, just like he doesn't flowbench any of his stuff, unfortunately



No one is arguing or complaining about price, I was commenting on the price compared to other companies and trying to find out more information about headers in general. I think you would agree that if Pacesetters were just as good hp wise as milzy but you'd have to spend 100 bucks on them to make them the same quality, you would probably go with pacesetters

you are doing just that, you are complaining about price.... you could not fix pace setters to make them the same quality as what i build. you deff could not do it for only 100 bucks. thats just laughable. do you under stand that the V band assemblies alone are over 100 bucks for the 3 that we use? the collectors would have to be changed as well as the entire crossover pipe. just let it alone.

[trewyn15]

Originally Posted by HOYS

To the "MMS does not flow bench parts": Wrong. Dead wrong. Mike (as others) know that flow numbers aren't everything, they are a bad way to measure performance of a certain part. This is a different debate, it has been talked about, don't muck this thread up with it. Search for the other threads.

To make Pacesetters the "Same" quality you would have to do a good bit of work.

Coating: Everyone knows, ArmorCoat is NOT ceramic coating like we know on other headers. Armor Coat is crap. Expect 175+ shipping for a good Ceramic Coat on the headers.

I haven't personally seen a whole lot of test results for any of Milzy's products, if he has them, then he could use some updating to the site, which I think he knows, and is a completely different topic.

I was looking at the Pacesetters on Wot-Tech which you are right is the 175 for the ceramic coating. I thought pacesetter fixed most of the issues with this newest set of headers?

I guess I honestly don't konw enough about the vbands and such, I was talking more about cleaning welds and such, which is all I heard from word of mouth.

Originally Posted by slw240sx

you are doing just that, you are complaining about price.... you could not fix pace setters to make them the same quality as what i build. you deff could not do it for only 100 bucks. thats just laughable. do you under stand that the V band assemblies alone are over 100 bucks for the 3 that we use? the collectors would have to be changed as well as the entire crossover pipe. just let it alone.

This is a forum so it's more of a discussion and you learn on forums so I'm learning the difference between the two headers and also learning why the pricing is different.

Calm down dude, state facts don't get angry and cuss.. Doesn't leave a good rep for the business.

[young gun]

You're so annoying

[trewyn15]

Originally Posted by young gun

You're so annoying

please do something about it hahaha

"come at me bro"

:P chill dude

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by HOYS

Whats with the crazy text?

I was trying to make the point that Pacesetters wouldn't be worth the cost to modify to make them anywhere near Milzy's quality.

No they wouldn't and it wouldn't even be possible since they are different materials. Trying to would be a severe waste of money and not worth it. But it would be worth improving them a little where you can. I'm going to be modifying mine mainly for the learning experience but also to rid the system of some of the problem areas.

But all the talk of the primaries being tiny is kind of silly in my opinion. The primaries on the pacesetters are 1.5" ID (I measured them) and as stated in the first post here the primaries are 1.625" or 1 5/8". Now maybe I don't know that much about headers but that's a difference of 1/8" between the two. How is that a major difference? But I do agree there are many other issues with the pacesetters, but some can be improved with a little extra time and a little extra cash.

I'm actually considering doing my own custom set maybe in the future. So even if these only last a year or two I'll be fine with that.

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by slw240sx

its sad that you think 1K is expensive when it comes to custom performance parts. you would have a heart attack if you tried to build a turbo car... some people just believe in buying and supporting companies that produce good products, and not supporting people that will just mass produce **** to make a buck.

That last part made me laugh. You telling me you don't buy absolutely anything from China or some other part of the world with cheap labor? That's hard to do. But yes good products deserve to be supported and generally hold up way better.

[trewyn15]

Originally Posted by chris_gt_74

That last part made me laugh. You telling me you don't buy absolutely anything from China or some other part of the world with cheap labor? That's hard to do. But yes good products deserve to be supported and generally hold up way better.

he's right tho, it's not a ton, but for the platform we're all working with it is a lot, if i were to do a turbo build it would be in 2 years when i can afford something like a camaro to get a lot of power out of.

$1k is 1/4 of what I paid for my monte, which makes it hard to justify spending the grand on headers

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by trewyn15

he's right tho, it's not a ton, but for the platform we're all working with it is a lot, if i were to do a turbo build it would be in 2 years when i can afford something like a camaro to get a lot of power out of.

$1k is 1/4 of what I paid for my monte, which makes it hard to justify spending the grand on headers

I agree. For what the car is worth and capable of it's not really worth it unless it is your thing and you've got the money to burn to make it all you can. I wouldn't knock anyone for spending the $1k though, it's their car and their choice. I understand you get what you pay for and some are okay with that.

[trewyn15]

Originally Posted by chris_gt_74

I agree. For what the car is worth and capable of it's not really worth it unless it is your thing and you've got the money to burn to make it all you can. I wouldn't knock anyone for spending the $1k though, it's their car and their choice. I understand you get what you pay for and some are okay with that.

right, and that's not saying we're not hardcore car guys, or broke college kids, or stupid teenagers or something like that, it's saying that we can't justify spending that much money on something that is only worth 4 times the price. or at least spending that on a single mod. or at least that's how I feel about that.

Which is exactly why I'm asking about the comparisons with this and the Pacesetters and S&S headers, not trying to be a prick just seeing where the jump in price is coming from. Sorry everyone, if I come off as a prick mosttimes it's completely unintentional.

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by trewyn15

right, and that's not saying we're not hardcore car guys, or broke college kids, or stupid teenagers or something like that, it's saying that we can't justify spending that much money on something that is only worth 4 times the price. or at least spending that on a single mod. or at least that's how I feel about that.

Which is exactly why I'm asking about the comparisons with this and the Pacesetters and S&S headers, not trying to be a prick just seeing where the jump in price is coming from. Sorry everyone, if I come off as a prick mosttimes it's completely unintentional.

It would be cool to actually know what the pacesetters can do vs others just to put it to rest. I'm not convinced any of them really perform better than each other by drastic means but I am only speculating because I'm no expert. But appearance and durability pacesetter loses.

[tw0123]

Originally Posted by chris_gt_74

It would be cool to actually know what the pacesetters can do vs others just to put it to rest. I'm not convinced any of them really perform better than each other by drastic means but I am only speculating because I'm no expert. But appearance and durability pacesetter loses.

As mentioned numerous times in this thread, it is not so much about the actual performance differences, it is a lot about the fitment, quality of craftsmanship and length of time these will last vs. the pacesetters... quality costs money... yes they are expensive, but you know they will bolt right up and last... with fewer leaks, fitment issues and rust...

[young gun]

All of this information just keeps getting recycled because someone can't read. Your problem is your bitching. You got to pay to play buddy. So fork out the cash or shut your damn mouth and go buy a 300hp car.

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by young gun

All of this information just keeps getting recycled because someone can't read. Your problem is your bitching. You got to pay to play buddy. So fork out the cash or shut your damn mouth and go buy a 300hp car.

Who are you talking to?

[trewyn15]

Originally Posted by tw0123

As mentioned numerous times in this thread, it is not so much about the actual performance differences, it is a lot about the fitment, quality of craftsmanship and length of time these will last vs. the pacesetters... quality costs money... yes they are expensive, but you know they will bolt right up and last... with fewer leaks, fitment issues and rust...

correct, but I haven't seen anyone really post any real evidence of where the leaks are with the pacesetters (althought I've heard of it a lot), and I thought they fixed fitment issues with their latest headers?

are there the same issues with the S&S? Seems like from what I read the S&S were peoples favorite so far?

Originally Posted by chris_gt_74

Who are you talking to?

he's talking to me he must be having a rough weekend.

I'm just trying to figure out more about all Milzy, Pacesetter and S&S headers, and no one with the Milzy headers has talked yet about them.

[icecats87]

If i had the money i would have bought milzy headers. But i had to go with the ****setters. Yes i fell a HP increase and change in exhaust tone. But i know they wont last long. I know if i bought milzy headers I wouldn't have to worry about getting new headers in a year.

Originally Posted by tw0123

As mentioned numerous times in this thread, it is not so much about the actual performance differences, it is a lot about the fitment, quality of craftsmanship and length of time these will last vs. the pacesetters... quality costs money... yes they are expensive, but you know they will bolt right up and last... with fewer leaks, fitment issues and rust...

This is 100% true as i recently installed the pacesetters and it was a ****ing pain. There are a lot of problems with fitment. Here is my list

First: On the front headers the far right stud and middle stud (Top ones) are very hard to tighten, you cant fit any ratchets back there. you have to use the open end side of a wrench, and you can only turn it maybe 30 degrees. these 2 bolts alone took 30 minutes just to get them on.

Second: Where the front headers and crossover pipe meet. It is at an angle, so you can tighten the top one pretty easy (have to hold a wrench on one side, use socket on the nut) But the bottom on is in the worse spot. You cant fit any ratchets down there and you can barely even fit a wrench. the only way you can get it good and tight is if the LIM is off, But if you were just installing the headers why do all that just for 1 freaking bolt.

Third: Again by the crossover/front header the radiator hose actually rests on the headers. I had to buy exhaust wrap and wrap the headers and the hose so it wouldn't melt a hole through it.

Fourth: The Y-Pipe. This is the biggest pain in the ass. It is located in the worse spot ever. there is only 1 spot each exhaust clamp to be to even reach with wrench or socket. and its very hard to even tighten them.

Im sure ill run into a lot more problems with them down the road but I do have some ideas to modify them.

I wish i could have gotten milzy headers, they look amazing. The fitment on them is probably perfect, and easy, If you want to discuss "best headers" for these cars then they would be it. Like everyone says you have to pay to play.

Edit: Oh i forgot the other thing, on the rear headers the lower bolt closest to ps pump. You cant use a stud and nut on it. The stud goes in fine but the way its welded the nut hits the top of the headers and has no clearance of it to be tightened. So i had to use just a bolt which i would rather have a stud on it like the others.

[HOYS]

Ah another thing about MMS headers...every bolt can be gotten to with a socket wrench + extension.

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by trewyn15

correct, but I haven't seen anyone really post any real evidence of where the leaks are with the pacesetters (althought I've heard of it a lot), and I thought they fixed fitment issues with their latest headers?

are there the same issues with the S&S? Seems like from what I read the S&S were peoples favorite so far?



he's talking to me he must be having a rough weekend.

I'm just trying to figure out more about all Milzy, Pacesetter and S&S headers, and no one with the Milzy headers has talked yet about them.

The biggest faulty component of the pacesetters is the y pipe in my opinion. It sucks by design and fitment. Icecats87 just got his pacesetters installed and I'm following his progress to see what issues he has with his.

[icecats87]

Originally Posted by HOYS

Ah another thing about MMS headers...every bolt can be gotten to with a socket wrench + extension.

I would almost pay $600 more just so i would be able to use sockets to install it instead of turning a freaking nut 30 degrees with your end in a awkward position. then dropping the wrench to the floor, picking it up and repeat that process for a hour. Oh and after your head will loose feeling :P

[canadian_racer]

Originally Posted by slw240sx

its sad that you think 1K is expensive when it comes to custom performance parts. you would have a heart attack if you tried to build a turbo car... some people just believe in buying and supporting companies that produce good products, and not supporting people that will just mass produce **** to make a buck.

[chris_gt_74]

Originally Posted by icecats87

I would almost pay $600 more just so i would be able to use sockets to install it instead of turning a freaking nut 30 degrees with your end in a awkward position. then dropping the wrench to the floor, picking it up and repeat that process for a hour. Oh and after your head will loose feeling :P

LOL I'd pay more but not sure about $600 more. I too would love to get the higher quality but my list of wants always is way longer than my funds so I cut corners and get the best bang for my buck. Hell I've been wanting the sc/t kit and borla exhaust for a couple of years now and still have neither . More important things take presidence than car fun for me .