tuning problem.

[HOYS]

Originally Posted by PhantomLover007

Ok cool. Too bad you and Aaron aren't near each other or you guys could compare them

HP Tuners is pretty nice. I believe between the two they both have the same tables available. HP Tuners uses proprietary .hpt files instead of .bin files so you can't open them up with open source editors that are out there (not really important but it is something)

HP Tuner is still under constant development so improvements are always on the way...and you can use it on a lot of vehicles!

[sleepyalero]

okay this is weird, look at the table on the left. the TPS reads 90% thottle but notice the voltage is 0.00. now look to the right... it says its in the 40% area for tps. WTF??

[sleepyalero]

Originally Posted by PhantomLover007

Ok cool. Too bad you and Aaron aren't near each other or you guys could compare them

yeah haha.

[HOYS]

Originally Posted by sleepyalero

okay this is weird, look at the table on the left. the TPS reads 90% thottle but notice the voltage is 0.00. now look to the right... it says its in the 40% area for tps. WTF??

That looks like a part where you let off and the ECU read 90% throttle previously, but 0v and hadn't registered the change yet. Ooooor...you could have a borked PCM. It might also be something of a limp mode because of your 6spd swap and the car thinks the trans fluid is at -38 degrees F :P

Honestly with the 6 spd swap, who knows.

[HOYS]

Originally Posted by HOYS

That looks like a part where you let off and the ECU read 90% throttle previously, but 0v and hadn't registered the change yet. Ooooor...you could have a borked PCM. It might also be something of a limp mode because of your 6spd swap and the car thinks the trans fluid is at -38 degrees F :P

Honestly with the 6 spd swap, who knows.

Also, I'm 100% sure Milzy just turned off the CELs for all the transmission problems...but you can't disable the logic that creates limp modes. This could be an issue.

[sleepyalero]

Yeah im not sure what it is.... I need to see what milzy says.

[Starglow]

Originally Posted by HOYS

HP Tuners is pretty nice. I believe between the two they both have the same tables available. HP Tuners uses proprietary .hpt files instead of .bin files so you can't open them up with open source editors that are out there (not really important but it is something)

HP Tuner is still under constant development so improvements are always on the way...and you can use it on a lot of vehicles!

You guys might want to check out Tiny Tuner...

http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.as...heck=837311520

[HOYS]

Originally Posted by Starglow

You guys might want to check out Tiny Tuner...

http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.as...heck=837311520

Tiny Tuner was what I was referencing as an open source tuner.

Tiny Tuner has no PCM write capabilities, all it can do it edit .bin files. Its nice because it is directed at GM FWD V6 applications so a lot of parameters are defined (more so than HP Tuners which did FWD junk as an after thought, was initially geared towards V8 guys).

Tiny Tuner is actually a program we don't really need as there are other open source "open" .bin editors that are FAR more powerful and robust but they come as a blank slate, no definitions at all.

Tl:dr: Tiny tuners can edit files, not flash them, so you still need HPT or some other cable based tuner.

[Starglow]

BTW....do you know if Mike locks the PCM after he does a tune?

[AleroB888]

Like's been said, change the TPS plug if you haven't already.

I just went through that with a MAF sensor plug, that's no fun at all.....

At least you can see what's happening now, ha

[sleepyalero]

Originally Posted by Starglow

BTW....do you know if Mike locks the PCM after he does a tune?

i dont think he does. atleast not on mine, im able to change alot of things on my own and re flash my PCM. i dont know exactly yet how i can inch more power out of the car, but soon enough i will change some things.

Originally Posted by AleroB888

Like's been said, change the TPS plug if you haven't already.

I just went through that with a MAF sensor plug, that's no fun at all.....

At least you can see what's happening now, ha

yes, im very happy i can now see this, without this tuner i would have never known of this issue, no engine codes ever popped a light. so no light, i dont go check engine codes.

how did you connect a new maf sensor plug? solder? wire connectors? please inform.

ps. im glad you finally stopped in here!

Originally Posted by HOYS

That looks like a part where you let off and the ECU read 90% throttle previously, but 0v and hadn't registered the change yet. Ooooor...you could have a borked PCM. It might also be something of a limp mode because of your 6spd swap and the car thinks the trans fluid is at -38 degrees F :P

Honestly with the 6 spd swap, who knows.

okay, now that im actually home and dont have to think on typing and talk to a buddy at the same time....

im pretty positive i was still WOT. like i said when i floor it the TPS % will read to a certain extent (say 78%) then will just suddenly drop to 0% while im still WOT. but the chart on the left of that pic shows i was at 90% throttle. possibly was still gaining then i let out after i saw the TPS % was dropping on the gauges chart.

i will test this again tomorrow night before i decide on replacing the pigtail for the TPS. but i just dont understand why both charts are not reading the same TPS %.

[AaronGTR]

best way to hook up a new sensor lead is with crimped connections and heat shrink. Solder connections actually increase electrical resistance a tiny bit and can skew the readings.I also agree with Hoys that you really need a digital multimeter. It is essential for diagnosing electrical problems. It's not really that hard to use. The trick with the paperclip and a jumper wire with alligator clips that he mentioned is a good one I've used before.I really think you should get the meter and check the volts at the plug and replace the plug and lead before you start messing around with other stuff. I think there's a good possibility that is the problem.

as for the difference between tuners, I think DHP and HPT have basically the same capabilities now. They just have different file names for things, and go about things in a slightly different way.they both have their plus and minus. HPT is still in business so you still get development and customer support. DHP isn't around anymore, but all cars are open in the latest software version and you can use open source tuners like tiny tuner with more features, so you can tune almost any FWD GM car from 96 to 05. HPT is much more expensive and charges a ton of money for extra car licenses which is the major downside if you want to help other people tune their cars. And they charge extra for the pro version with more features like the analog input, which was pretty much standard on DHP. HPT hasn't put much development into their FWD software since they focus on v8 cars, the plus side being if you had say an fbody or vette and a Grand Am, you could get licenses and tune both with HPT. I would use a DHP though to tune other peoples cars for cheap.

[AleroB888]

Originally Posted by AaronGTR

best way to hook up a new sensor lead is with crimped connections and heat shrink. Solder connections actually increase electrical resistance a tiny bit and can skew the readings. ....

A properly done solder connection is going to be better than a crimped-on connection. However, heat shrink insulating over crimped connections should be adequate.

[AaronGTR]

Originally Posted by AleroB888

A properly done solder connection is going to be better than a crimped-on connection. However, heat shrink insulating over crimped connections should be adequate.

It "might" be stronger... but like I said, solder actually increases electrical resistance. A properly done crimp connection is plenty strong and is low resistance, and with a good heat shrink over it, it will be strong and weather tight. They make crimp connectors with heat shrink ends already on them that melt like plastic onto the wire. We used both kinds of crimps at my last job at L3 communications, and they are standard in the electrical industry. If they are good enough for a 1.5 million dollars x-ray machine, they are good enough for his car.

[HOYS]

sleepy, do you have the pro HP tuners? I would be really cool to data log the voltage at the sensor and what the pcm reports at the same time

[sleepyalero]

Thanks guys, yes i have the pro. I said that in first post!

[AleroB888]

Originally Posted by AaronGTR

It "might" be stronger... but like I said, solder actually increases electrical resistance. A properly done crimp connection is plenty strong and is low resistance, and with a good heat shrink over it, it will be strong and weather tight. They make crimp connectors with heat shrink ends already on them that melt like plastic onto the wire. We used both kinds of crimps at my last job at L3 communications, and they are standard in the electrical industry. If they are good enough for a 1.5 million dollars x-ray machine, they are good enough for his car.

OK, by exactly how much does the resistance increase over crimped? What percentage of the total circuit resistance is it, after you add in the resistance of the length of wire to the PCM?

And why would NASA use solder connections at all when it would be cheaper just to use all crimped splices?

Check pages 81-86:

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/codeq/doctree/87394.pdf

[sleepyalero]

Okay i just picked up a new tps pig tail. It came with a blue black and grey wire.

I assume its self explanitory for install?

Blue to blue

Black to black

Grey to i think its... A yellow w/black line in it on stock wires?

That or i could just match where the wires goes into the stock plug and go off what wires go where for the new plug.

[sleepyalero]

Alright, changed pig tail. Getting 100% throttle with key in on position (not running)

Still reading same voltage through HPT, i know, use a multimeter.

Still recieving this...

P1122 throttle position (tp) sensor circuit intermittent low voltage (history) (immature)



Seems i just wasted 22$. Might just have to return it come monday maybe, since so far i havent seen much improvement.

Ill be doing a drive scan later to see if the throttle will reach 100% then. Report back later.

[AleroB888]

Originally Posted by sleepyalero

okay this is weird, look at the table on the left. the TPS reads 90% thottle but notice the voltage is 0.00. now look to the right... it says its in the 40% area for tps. WTF??

Uhh, 11 degrees of Knock Retard? Where's that coming from?

HOYS may be on to something about the limp home mode. But when I had an actual TPS failure and the limp mode, the car would barely accelerate the whole time.

This could be a limp mode not caused by the TPS, which commands the TPS to a specific value regardless of the actual gas pedal position.
Yikes, I hope it's just an intermittant wire to the PCM.

Be careful driving it at this point, man.