Sweet.. Caramel colored oil cap.

[AaronGAGT]

Ok... so a couple weeks ago I did realize that my gasket was leaking a little bit... so i figured ok, I'll take it to get replaced next week. Periodically I checked the oil cap, dip stick and coolant for anything fishy... everything seemed fine except the "low coolant" light came on once and I filled it up. I havent been driving it for the past few days so today I went to pull it in the garage to get it off the street.

so from the street to the garage, i notice this weird ticking noise... a little bit louder than the "noisy lifter" problems... so i turn it off and check the oil level and coolant levels. Sadly I find out, the bottom of the oil cap looks like caramel.

My question is... i"m supposed to get it fixed in 3 days, but should I drive it there or tow it there? Also... I know this is awful for the engine... but is there any hope? Please help me.

[01silverGT]

you should be ok to drive it there, most of the time the engine survives but every case is different. how many miles are on it??

[AaronGAGT]

I have 86k on it...

[01silverGT]

is this your first intake???

[AaronGAGT]

yea

[82-T/A]

ABSOLUTELY DO NOT DRIVE IT.

I'm sorry, you have WATER in your oil, you DO NOT want to drive it, this will literally destroy your engine bearings. DO NOT DRIVE IT TO THE GARAGE> HAVE IT TOWED. I can NOT express this enough.

DO NOT DRIVE IT.

[CelticSkyhawk]

I have to agree with 82... had this problem with a Saturn and the engine was blown by the time it got to the shop.

[01silverGT]

if it has 86,000 on the intake its probally too late anyway

[AaronGAGT]

.... well it just turned to that milky colored stuff like the other day... havent been driving it or anything since obviously... u really think its done with?

[82-T/A]

No, it doesn't necessarily mean it's done for good, though it certainly has lessened the life of your motor.

Don't even bother starting the car. If you can, you should go out and drain the oil immediately... and then fill it back up with fresh oil. But do not start it. Right now, as we speak, the coolant is slowly eating away at your crank bearings like an acid. I don't mean to be the drama queen, but this is about as bad as you can get short of actually having a spun bearing.

Have it towed to a shop ASAP, and have them replace the intake manifold gaskets. Absolutely do not start the car by any means.

[FORTEEN3GT]

400.00 normal shop repair......

i would recommend installing new ported heads and definately porting the upper and lower intake while you are at it.....

if you have a 62mm tb...then it would be wise to port the plenum to match. TB to Plenum is one of the best mods bang for buck!

Only if you have the money! Peace and sorry about the bad news! Has or will happen to all of us......i am experiencing the same thing right now...!

[Slim]

One more bit of info to add. After the repair is done, change your oil after about 250-300 miles. This will help to get rid of the creamy goo that's in your engine.

[FORTEEN3GT]

like 82/TA said.....go 200-300 miles with cheap oil to wear it in...then switch to your synthetic oil!

[71Z28RS]

Hey Aaron,

First off, sorry to hear that it's your turn for the intake gasket ordeal. That really sucks.

Antifreeze in the crankcase is very bad, yes, but it's not necessarily as apocoliptic as some of these postings are making it sound. I'm certainly not saying that you should drive it up to Bate's for a couple of burgers before heading up to the AMC20, but saying that you've already shortened the life of your engine can certainly freak you out a little more than necessary.

There is antifreeze in your engine. Not good. But you have said that you haven't driven it since. That is very, very good. Yes, there probably has been microscopic damage to your rod bearings. Maybe even to your valve train. But, I doubt that you'll ever notice it for as long as you have your car. Our intake gasket went at 45,000 miles, and we didn't have any clue until the low coolant light came on twice (ours is a 96 and it wasn't well known that the intake gasket was a regular issue yet), so I filled it back up and watched it for a couple of days to see where it might be leaking. About a week later, (a whole week!) I changed the oil because it was due for it's 3000 mile change. That's when I figured it out. Whoops. How many miles of driving with antifreeze in the crankcase? Waaaaay too many. So, with fresh oil in the engine, I made a warranty appointment and drove it to the dealership. Our GA just broke 120,000 last week, and it's still running like a top. Pretty quietly too. So, damage to the bearings probably did happen, but 75,000 miles later and it still hasn't been the end of the world for our GA.

Not every case is the same, and not everyone has the same luck with certain things, but since you noticed yours was leaking right away and knew enough to not drive it once you found out, I'd put my money on everything turning out just fine.

Good luck with everything!

[82-T/A]

71Z, I'm just trying to impose the importance to him that he does not drive it in it's current condition. The truth is.. it IS really bad. You've gotten lucky. I've had the same thing, where I cracked a cyl head on a 1984 Fiero 2m4 SE because I didn't burp the cooling system after installing a BRAND NEW cyl head (yes, I know.. that sucked, an expensive lesson). In any case, I mixed coolant and oil. I only drove maybe a few miles or so before I realized it.

I then changed it out. We were able to put another 8-9 thousand miles on the motor, but at this point right now, the car is a mess. The idle is poor because it wore the cam lobes down, and there are rattling wrist pins.

So, you COULD say I was also "unlucky". However, I still stand by my assertion that he should absolutely NOT drive it anywhere, and drain it out as soon as possible.


By the way.. I like the jokes down below! heh, but, Fuel Injection was offered in the late 50s Corvette, and CV joints were offered in the rear axle of all Corvettes as of the 1963 production year. (IRS)

FWD is a fad though!

[71Z28RS]

I definitely agree that he shouldn't drive it, but it seemed like you were saying that it's already over with, he's already screwed. I was just letting him know that he needs to be cautious, but he's most likely not screwed as of yet. I know that I'm moderately lucky with my intake situation, but I think that most of us are (if I were really lucky, it wouldn't have leaked at all). I'll bet that 20% of the people on this website have had the gasket leak problem, but I've never heard of anyone having the extreme results that you had with your Fiero. It sounds like you got the worst kind of bad luck on that one. I've been there, but I've noticed that the chances for moderate luck usually come in way higher than the chances for extreme bad. I just didn't want him to assume worst case when most of us really have no issues at all after having the intake gasket repaired. If we did, the GA owners would be getting new engines under warranty, not just a new gasket install. But then again, who knows?

I'm glad you like my signature. I've had some critisizm for that mentality by some of the younger crowd. Something about small cubes and better technology. I'll take 11 mpg in a big block when beating the pants off of a 30mpg Civic with nitrous any day. Call it wasteful and old school, but it's that's the way I like it.

Oh, and I did know the general histories of the fuel injected and independant rear susp Corvettes (not exact years though....you certainly know your Corvette facts better than I do), but since I don't own one, I like to state my fuel delivery and driveline preferences as if they were all powerful, all knowing fact. It makes life more interesting. Besides, there's nothing like the sound of the secondaries opening up on a large 4-barrel. If you can't smell unburned fuel in the exhaust, it's runnin' too lean!

By the way, that's a whole lot of vehicles you've got in your collection. Quite a variety too. Do they all run, or are some of them parts cars/project cars?

[AaronGAGT]

Hey guys, thanks for all the info.. it helps soo much. My mom says that AAA gives us free towing for a 10 mile radius so i'm just gonna have them tow it to my friends shop and have them look at it. I guess they can decide how bad it is. Thanks again guys!

[82-T/A]

71Z28RS, actually, that problem with the Fiero is very common but ONLY on the 4 cyl, not the V6. The 4 cyl in the Fiero (2.5 Iron Duke in 1984, and renamed to Tech-4 in 85), the cyl head would crack at nearly the first sign of overheating. It was ALWAYS the cyl heads too, and it would crack between the valves. The block is very sturdy, but the heads suck!

I agree though, his motor isn't doomed, but from the impression I got from him, he didn't seem to realize just how bad it was. I never meant to suggest that his motor was done-for, just that it WOULD be if he continued to drive on it.

Honestly, I'm a big fan of massive engines. There's nothing that brings a tear to my eye than hearing a 1974 Pontiac TransAm with a Cowl-Induction 455 Super-Duty with open headers.. or an original 1969 Pontiac GTO Judge with the Pontiac 400 RAM-AIR/4 motor. Or, of course, any legendary V8 from General Motors... the Buick V8, the Olds 455 Rocket V8, or the Chevy 454, or the 360hp 350 small block.. or even the 302 in the 69 Z-28 (69 I believe?).

I've got to admit though, I'm fascinated with the DOHC 2.4 TwinCam (and it's Quad-4 heritage). It's a very impressive motor. That's like my new thing, I'm trying to learn as much as I can about this motor, what pieces are interchangeable, and what's the most powerful combination you can make with matching factory parts from differnet years. You can make some CRAZY horsepower in these things with little displacement.

What motor / setup do you have in your 71?

As far as my cars go, the 97 GrandAm is in good shape, it's only got 65k miles on it. The 87 Fiero I JUST got running and I've been driving it around town. I bought it right out of high school, and blew my tax return from last year on a performance engine rebuild. Basically, all I did was install a performance cam, and a 3.1 crank and rods into a 2.8 (with new pistons, etc).

The 1984 Fiero 2m4 SE also runs, but I don't really drive it that much right now because of the way it runs. It's totally gutless, has a 4 cyl, automatic, with highway gears. It puts all of 92 horsepower (when new).

The 81 TransAm is in the middle of a complete (sub)frame-off restoration. I've already dropped like 3 grand into it, and I'm only 45% done. The difficult stuff is already done, but I need a little body work in the rear, and I'm really not looking forward to that.

The 73 VW Bus runs and drives... it actually looks REALLY good, all new chrome (well, polished aluminum.. heh) etc...

All the cars are registered, only 4 of them are insured (and what I consider driveable). The 97 GT, the 87 SE, the 84 SE, and the 73 VW.

You can see pictures of them at that link in my sig.

The 97 GT sits in the driveway, the 81 TransAm and the VW Bus have permenant spots in our garage, the 84 Fiero stays at my parents house (they keep it in their garage) and then my wife has a 2002 Jetta 1.8T. She's actually my fiance, but that's such a lame French word, that I'd rather just call her anything else.


Tell me about your Z?

[01silverGT]

i'll do the gaskets for $300 with parts!! i do at least 2-3 of these per day

[AaronGAGT]

Originally posted by 01silverGT
i'll do the gaskets for $300 with parts!! i do at least 2-3 of these per day

How do you do 2-3 a day?? Doing what?