Detriot Downsizing

GregFarz78 · 03-15-2005, 07:36 PM

GM and Ford are shedding market share and slashing production. Their new cars are underachieving. Their supplier spinoffs are teetering. Detroit appears destined for a smaller place in the auto universe.

This was to be a year of rebirth for Detroit's Big 2. But that's not what happened. General Motors and Ford Motor Co. have reached a tipping point. Incentives aren't working, new cars aren't generating excitement, and America's automakers are whacking production. The Big 2 are getting smaller.

Not much of a suprise here

Mike3800 · 03-15-2005, 09:50 PM

Toyota will be #1 in sales sooner than later.

Braves299 · 03-15-2005, 11:28 PM

fdakl'u[dsofj'soiuf'ghj'fa[oia'ljk
dsah'kl

Nikki · 03-16-2005, 07:23 AM

Please when spelling "Detroit" spell it RIGHT damnit!!!

Thats ok...I still get to see cool camo'd cars/trucks driving around Downtown hehe

GregFarz78 · 03-16-2005, 10:13 AM

More breaking news!

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...nm/autos_gm_dc

GM seems to be in a world of hurt right now....

heres my new top 3 toyota, honda, nissan

RAMAIRGT1 · 03-16-2005, 11:42 AM

thats why i'm buying an Acura, american cars suck

bigbenSC · 03-16-2005, 12:28 PM

GM stock has fallen more than 11% of it's total value today as of 2:30 pm, this is a big problem!

Ant · 03-16-2005, 03:06 PM

yeah, like I didn't see this comming. You see, ford and GM are releasing stuff that would have been great 4-5 years ago. right now, it's not cutting it. for example, we'll use engine power. although not the only reason why someone would buy a vehicle, it certainly is a factor (as far as i'm concerned). Nissan's venerable 3.5l v6 can push 270 horses, stock. gm's most powerfull n/a v6 (the new 3.9) is at a mere 240. go figure.

also, when other manufacturers are making leaps in terms of styling (scion anyone?), Ford and GM are staying conservative. being outrageous is a risk, sure, but you have to take some if your business is going anywhere.

PontiacGT2K · 03-16-2005, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ant

yeah, like I didn't see this comming. You see, ford and GM are releasing stuff that would have been great 4-5 years ago. right now, it's not cutting it. for example, we'll use engine power. although not the only reason why someone would buy a vehicle, it certainly is a factor (as far as i'm concerned). Nissan's venerable 3.5l v6 can push 270 horses, stock. gm's most powerfull n/a v6 (the new 3.9) is at a mere 240. go figure.

Actually, this year they upped it to 287hp, still ~30 mpg

bigbenSC · 03-16-2005, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ant

gm's most powerfull n/a v6 (the new 3.9) is at a mere 240. go figure.

Nope, the 3.6 in the CTS, STS, and SRX puts out 260 (this could be better as well) with it's modern design (DOHC, VVT, Aluminum). Unfortunately GM thinks that only vehicles that sticker at $35,000 plus deserve the competitive powertrains. Transmissions follow the same path, Cadillac gets the 5 speeds while every other division keeps 4 speeders. The funny thing about that is that even a 5 speed auto is not class leading in the cars GM puts it in. GM needs to do make a Nissan like decision to put it's best engines in every car regardless of price!

PS. the Nissan VQ puts out 300 HP in a special edition 350Z this year and 298 in the G35 sport versions. Thats impressive!

Panacea · 03-16-2005, 04:30 PM

Hahhahhahaahahahhahhahahahahhahahahahhah

Actually it sucks because of the four or five good cars they produce, but funny for everything else.

Ant · 03-16-2005, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbengt67

Nope, the 3.6 in the CTS, STS, and SRX puts out 260 (this could be better as well) with it's modern design (DOHC, VVT, Aluminum). Unfortunately GM thinks that only vehicles that sticker at $35,000 plus deserve the competitive powertrains. Transmissions follow the same path, Cadillac gets the 5 speeds while every other division keeps 4 speeders. The funny thing about that is that even a 5 speed auto is not class leading in the cars GM puts it in. GM needs to do make a Nissan like decision to put it's best engines in every car regardless of price!

PS. the Nissan VQ puts out 300 HP in a special edition 350Z this year and 298 in the G35 sport versions. Thats impressive!

(about the engines) yes, very well put. Nissan doesn't care about having up level cars having the same engine as cheaper cars. They give the maxima, 350z, murano, fx series, and the g35s the same engine. why doesn't gm follow suit? nobody knows.

crazypontiac03 · 03-16-2005, 05:34 PM

By BY Gm/Ford, I think Toyota will be Number one by 2007!

GregFarz78 · 03-16-2005, 05:48 PM

If it werent for caddy and the vette where would GM be? Probably bankrupt by now. It seems GM and Ford are concentrating more on their SUV/Truck line up.

Mike3800 · 03-16-2005, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazypontiac03

By BY Gm/Ford, I think Toyota will be Number one by 2007!

End of 2005 or early 2006 at the latest.

Mike3800 · 03-16-2005, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregFarz78

If it werent for caddy and the vette where would GM be? Probably bankrupt by now.

What... they sell Vette's and Caddy's like hotcakes or something?

More like.... where would GM be without their best selling Aveo (as wierd as that sounds)

crazypontiac03 · 03-16-2005, 05:53 PM

I dont think however Gm/Ford will go bankrupt, They employ to many people here in the states for the Goverment to let that happen. I think it will be more of what happen to chrysler/dodge, Who know's maybe Toyota/Honda will by them out? Never know.

Mike3800 · 03-16-2005, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazypontiac03

Who know's maybe Toyota/Honda will by them out? Never know.

Hmmm.... the Toyota Mustang.

crazypontiac03 · 03-16-2005, 05:57 PM

Stranger things have happen. However i think they will keep the same name's just maybe some quailty and u know everything Gm and Ford can't seem to do Toyota will help them figure it out.

PontiacGT2K · 03-16-2005, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazypontiac03

Stranger things have happen. However i think they will keep the same name's just maybe some quailty and u know everything Gm and Ford can't seem to do Toyota will help them figure it out.

The only thing holding the U.S. auto manufacturers back is uber-conserative styling, and unions.

The only way they'll ever be successful is if they move manufacturing out of this country.

03-15-2005, 09:50 PM	#2
Mike3800 GAGT - Junkie AKA: Michael Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Northglenn, CO USA Age: 49 Posts: 3,394 Vehicle: 2015 Chrysler 200S AWD	Toyota will be #1 in sales sooner than later. __________________ -Mike

03-15-2005, 11:28 PM	#3
Braves299 WVU owns you AKA: David Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Derwood, Maryland Age: 36 Posts: 2,170 Vehicle: '99 GA SE 3.4, '06 Ram	fdakl'u[dsofj'soiuf'ghj'fa[oia'ljk dsah'kl __________________ Carl Lee Combs July 8, 1944 - February 20, 2002 "Gone for now, never forgotten"

03-16-2005, 07:23 AM	#4
Nikki 6 speed sickness. AKA: ~Nikki~ Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Sterling Heights, MI Age: 43 Posts: 1,892 Vehicle: '06 G6 GTP Sedan	Please when spelling "Detroit" spell it RIGHT damnit!!! Thats ok...I still get to see cool camo'd cars/trucks driving around Downtown hehe __________________ ::Redline Motorsport Member:: *Goodbye Accord & Talon...Hello G6 GTP 6MT*

03-16-2005, 10:13 AM	#5
GregFarz78 GAGT - Junkie AKA: See Above Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Philly, PA Age: 43 Posts: 4,413 Vehicle: 04 Honda S2000	More breaking news! http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...nm/autos_gm_dc GM seems to be in a world of hurt right now.... heres my new top 3 toyota, honda, nissan __________________ My Pics

03-16-2005, 11:42 AM	#6
RAMAIRGT1 Kick ass AKA: Yes Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Somewhere Posts: 832 Vehicle: Ford	thats why i'm buying an Acura, american cars suck __________________ Joe mama

03-15-2005, 07:36 PM	#1
GregFarz78 GAGT - Junkie AKA: See Above Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Philly, PA Age: 43 Posts: 4,413 Vehicle: 04 Honda S2000	Detriot Downsizing GM and Ford are shedding market share and slashing production. Their new cars are underachieving. Their supplier spinoffs are teetering. Detroit appears destined for a smaller place in the auto universe. This was to be a year of rebirth for Detroit's Big 2. But that's not what happened. General Motors and Ford Motor Co. have reached a tipping point. Incentives aren't working, new cars aren't generating excitement, and America's automakers are whacking production. The Big 2 are getting smaller. Not much of a suprise here __________________ My Pics

03-16-2005, 12:28 PM	#7
bigbenSC SC and Loving It! AKA: Ben Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lexington, KY Age: 36 Posts: 1,772 Vehicle: 2005 SRT-6, 2001 GA GT	GM stock has fallen more than 11% of it's total value today as of 2:30 pm, this is a big problem!

03-16-2005, 03:06 PM	#8
Ant LS2 - Member AKA: Anthony Join Date: May 2003 Location: DC metro area Age: 34 Posts: 2,251 Vehicle: S5/GTO	yeah, like I didn't see this comming. You see, ford and GM are releasing stuff that would have been great 4-5 years ago. right now, it's not cutting it. for example, we'll use engine power. although not the only reason why someone would buy a vehicle, it certainly is a factor (as far as i'm concerned). Nissan's venerable 3.5l v6 can push 270 horses, stock. gm's most powerfull n/a v6 (the new 3.9) is at a mere 240. go figure. also, when other manufacturers are making leaps in terms of styling (scion anyone?), Ford and GM are staying conservative. being outrageous is a risk, sure, but you have to take some if your business is going anywhere. __________________ USAF -06 IBM GTO/M6 - 477 WHP Best e/t before H/C - 12.71 @ 111.77 -18 Audi S5 Prestige Navarra Blue/A8 - DTUK Tuned 12.14 @ 111.19

03-16-2005, 04:30 PM	#11
Panacea Mmmm Donuts. AKA: Macleod52 Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Rock Island, IL Age: 40 Posts: 3,160 Vehicle: '09 Malibu LTZ	Hahhahhahaahahahhahhahahahahhahahahahhah Actually it sucks because of the four or five good cars they produce, but funny for everything else. __________________ "Never argue with idiots. They bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience."

03-16-2005, 05:34 PM	#13
crazypontiac03 MiDnIgHt AKA: Jason/Sparky Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: IL Age: 37 Posts: 3,019 Vehicle: 2008 HHR/05 Galant	By BY Gm/Ford, I think Toyota will be Number one by 2007! __________________ Ashes to ashes, dust to dust, if it wasn't for FORD's our tools would rust! "Unions were the rise and will be the fall of this Great Nation" "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in... And how many want out." Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you: 1. Jesus Christ 2. The American G. I. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom. -Tony Blair

03-16-2005, 05:48 PM	#14
GregFarz78 GAGT - Junkie AKA: See Above Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Philly, PA Age: 43 Posts: 4,413 Vehicle: 04 Honda S2000	If it werent for caddy and the vette where would GM be? Probably bankrupt by now. It seems GM and Ford are concentrating more on their SUV/Truck line up. __________________ My Pics

03-16-2005, 05:53 PM	#17
crazypontiac03 MiDnIgHt AKA: Jason/Sparky Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: IL Age: 37 Posts: 3,019 Vehicle: 2008 HHR/05 Galant	I dont think however Gm/Ford will go bankrupt, They employ to many people here in the states for the Goverment to let that happen. I think it will be more of what happen to chrysler/dodge, Who know's maybe Toyota/Honda will by them out? Never know. __________________ Ashes to ashes, dust to dust, if it wasn't for FORD's our tools would rust! "Unions were the rise and will be the fall of this Great Nation" "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in... And how many want out." Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you: 1. Jesus Christ 2. The American G. I. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom. -Tony Blair

03-16-2005, 05:57 PM	#19
crazypontiac03 MiDnIgHt AKA: Jason/Sparky Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: IL Age: 37 Posts: 3,019 Vehicle: 2008 HHR/05 Galant	Stranger things have happen. However i think they will keep the same name's just maybe some quailty and u know everything Gm and Ford can't seem to do Toyota will help them figure it out. __________________ Ashes to ashes, dust to dust, if it wasn't for FORD's our tools would rust! "Unions were the rise and will be the fall of this Great Nation" "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in... And how many want out." Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you: 1. Jesus Christ 2. The American G. I. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom. -Tony Blair

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