GTO not dead Afterall?!?!

[Pontiac Ninja]

This news probably reduces the small chance we have of seeing a new Firebird.

New GTO coming around the bend
Wednesday, March 01, 2006
Joshua Dowling
Special to The Plain Dealer

Geneva, Switzerland- The Pontiac GTO isn't dead after all, says a top General Motors Corp. executive, who also hinted there might be a new ultra-fast Corvette coming.

The current GTO will be phased out at the end of this year, but an all-new model is expected to return at the end of 2008 as a 2009 model, said Bob Lutz, who heads GM's global vehicle development.

Lutz stopped short of confirming that, saying: "There will be something special for the Corvette soon." When "Blue Devil" was mentioned, he simply smiled.

The GTO, however, is definitely on the way.

Last year, it appeared that GM had canceled any future GTOs as part of its efforts to reduce costs. And a Pontiac spokesman confirmed this year that the last GTOs would be sold this summer because the model wouldn't meet a new airbag standard taking effect in the fall. The spokesman said that the automaker would like to have another GTO but that there was nothing to announce.

Has anyone else read this or heard anything?? WTF!?!?! If this is true the new GTO when it comes out, had better look like it can eat any car for breakfast just like the 98-02 TA WS6s did!!

[Panacea]

Doesn't surprise me. I did hear about them redesigning the GTO about 3-6 months ago. Oh well. Good news.

[kingsofcrunk]

Originally Posted by Pontiac Ninja

This news probably reduces the small chance we have of seeing a new Firebird.



Has anyone else read this or heard anything?? WTF!?!?! If this is true the new GTO when it comes out, had better look like it can eat any car for breakfast just like the 98-02 TA WS6s did!!

[Pontiac Ninja]

Originally Posted by kingsofcrunk

You mean welcome to 3 days ago, do you see the date on the article?!?! This was JUST announced and plans for the GTO changed, AGAIN.

Don't be stupid and come in here like you know everything and this makes no sense. Its been changing back and forth for some time. Maybe you didn't actually read the article? You haven't even been involved in any of the threads in this section that have been discussed in the last few weeks about the GTO being officially canceled and of a possible new Firebird:

GTO officially gone after 06

[Pontiac Ninja]

GM got the Memo: 2009 Pontiac Firebird

[Cormaster]

Who knows man, you never can be too sure. I personally don't like the GTO, and watn the Firebird back. I like the early 70's GTO, but not as much as I liked the 1rst or 2nd generation firebird. The Firebird ran from 67 to 2002, the gto... not sure but I don't think it even ran for 10 years. Which one do you bring back? Which one is smarter? I think the firebird is personally, but this is GM we're talking about here, who decided intially to axe the firebired because "people don't want sports cars anymore, they want SUV's" and even know a billion of us F-body fans signed petitions and sent them to GM, they just wadded them up, threw 'em in the garbage, and got rid of our firebirds and camaros, replacing them with a souped up grand am, and a $42,000 el camino.

[nascarnate326]

Originally Posted by Cormaster

replacing them with a souped up grand am, and a $42,000 el camino.

LOL, i never looked at it that way. Souped up Grand Am or not, i like it

[blckgagt]

first of all the GTO was never confirmed to be cancelled, it was only speculation. And they always planned on bringing it back after this past model. The only thing they were really debating was the platform to use. I know there has been a ton of rumors going around, this was the only consistent rumor that has been going on for years. Not even GM would be dumb enough to bring the GTO back for a few years then all of a sudden bring back the firebird, that would be retarded. Plus as much as i loved the firebirds, we DO NOT need another Camaro/Firebird rivalry which plagued them, all they were was rebadges of each other. Having the Corvette at the top, then the GTO, followed by the camaro is a smart move.

[Cormaster]

Far more than a rebadge

But I think it would be far smarter to just bring the next gen F-body back to its full glory. The GTO died in the 70's, bringing it back was stupid... especially bringing it back as a poor mans BMW sports car!

I know people have talked about how out of date the F-body was, however they planned on doing away with the F-body in 2002 back in 1998... in 1998 they would of had plenty of time to create an all new platform for the next gen camaro and firebird to ride on. As far as I know the new mustang is on an all new platform, why not the camaro and firebird?

[GregFarz78]

This is good news...GM doesnt need to bring back the firebird the camaro is enough.

ultra-fast corvette? doesnt the z06 already run low 12s stock? GM trying to compete with a ferrari or something

[Panacea]

Originally Posted by Cormaster

Far more than a rebadge

But I think it would be far smarter to just bring the next gen F-body back to its full glory. The GTO died in the 70's, bringing it back was stupid... especially bringing it back as a poor mans BMW sports car!

Sort of how the Trans Am/Camaro died out in 2002?!?

[Panacea]

Originally Posted by GregFarz78

This is good news...GM doesnt need to bring back the firebird the camaro is enough.

ultra-fast corvette? doesnt the z06 already run low 12s stock? GM trying to compete with a ferrari or something

Try high 11's.

[nascarnate326]

Originally Posted by GregFarz78

GM trying to compete with a ferrari or something

I think they already do...

[SectoidBob]

i would LOVE for the firebird/camaro to come back personally, much more than the GTO. The firebird is a much more evocative nameplate than the GTO. While the goat was a great car in its day, i think GM would be smarter to try and reinvent the F-bodies, maybe with the same success that Ford had with the Mustang.

And while they're at it, a ridiculously large engine would be nice

[Cormaster]

Originally Posted by SectoidBob

i would LOVE for the firebird/camaro to come back personally, much more than the GTO. The firebird is a much more evocative nameplate than the GTO. While the goat was a great car in its day, i think GM would be smarter to try and reinvent the F-bodies, maybe with the same success that Ford had with the Mustang.

And while they're at it, a ridiculously large engine would be nice

Hell yeah man!! thats what I'm saying The GTO was the sh*t in the 70's but is time has passed. The firebird and camaro had been made up untill 2002 so they both are still popular. as for me, I'm wanting to get an early 4th gen firebird by the end of this year. I thought about modding the grand am, but with the potential of rear wheel drive...hell I always wanted a TA to begin with anway, screw the N-body!

I would of had an '80 camaro had it not been for my uncle. I was 17 years old and had the money saved up and everything. ME and my dad (the bargain king...got 4 grand taken off the grand am price) were about to go make an offer on a '80 camaro the next day...then my uncle called (who at the time drove a 1991 firebird formula) that if i got an F-body I'd end up killing myself in the snow. The freaked out and forbid it and I ended up getting stuck with a 1989 Chevrolet Cavalier wagon!

Nowadays as far as the F-body goes, its gotta be a TA, screw the camaro. I hate to be that pickey, but its pontiac or nothing!

[Graxall]

Originally Posted by Cormaster

The GTO died in the 70's, bringing it back was stupid... especially bringing it back as a poor mans BMW sports car!

Ahh yes a 40,000 POOR mans sports car. This old man sports car that has a rediculously nice interior as well as exterior...

[02andahalfgt]

Originally Posted by Cormaster

Far more than a rebadge

But I think it would be far smarter to just bring the next gen F-body back to its full glory. The GTO died in the 70's, bringing it back was stupid... especially bringing it back as a poor mans BMW sports car!

I know people have talked about how out of date the F-body was, however they planned on doing away with the F-body in 2002 back in 1998... in 1998 they would of had plenty of time to create an all new platform for the next gen camaro and firebird to ride on. As far as I know the new mustang is on an all new platform, why not the camaro and firebird?

No, it's not 'far more than a rebadge'. They share the same drive train, same engine options and similar cheaply designed interiors.
Before GM pulled the plug their only competition was the Mustang. There's no reason for GM to build two cars to compete against one and also each other. It would make far more sense to concentrate on one car. That way they wouldn't have to skimp on any details.
And despite what you think, since GM doesn't care about you, the Camaro is the better choice since it has far more history than the Firebird. The Pontiac always lived in big brother's shadow. Especially if they're going retro like the current Camaro concept. Go to just about any classic car show in the summer, you'll see far more later 60's Camaros than late 60's Firebirds. (example used because the Camaro concept resembles that generation)

[Cormaster]

I guess its really all speculation right now. I got a feeling the GTO is finally gone for good, thank god, they really disgraced that nameplate, about as bad as they disgraced the "monte carlo", and "impala" nameplates. from what I've seen of the concept drawings if there is indeed to be a 2008/2009 GTO I'm not crazy about it, while the last one looked like a bland grand am, the new one is going to look like bland early 90's grand prix. I say build our "bandit style" trans am. They don't have to put decals on it, we can get that done aftermarket, besides the decals may not be that marketable, but I know I'm sick of all this "kidney grill" BS they keep releasing.

I just think its sad that my GAGT sitting in my driveway looks 100 times more agressive than our last GTO. Pontiac needs to stop being BMW and get back to its performance roots. I say the lineup should be like this:

Solstice:
keep the main one as the Solstice SE, and the turbo as the Solstice GXP
G5:
rumors of a 260hp version using a FWD version of thet solstice GXP powtrain is great! however they should radically restyle it and make sure that Chevy and saturn dont' get a version of it. I also suggest a new name, maybe "sunfire" or "sunbird", or something different entirely. maybe just call it the "lemans"
G6:
I think the G6 is great, however its too much on the bandwagon for "accord", "mazda 6" etc. They need to give it some grand am styling cues, call it the grand am, and drop the GTP and release a high performance version with 275+ HP
Grand Prix:
I think the name should stay, and the car needs to go fullsize, since the G6 is officially a midsize car. it also needs to be on a RWD platform, and should be offered in coupe only. I'm envisioning something somewhat shaped like its old G-body predecessor. Should have the 3900 and LS3 in its engine options.
Then their sports car, the Firebird

Everything else should be dropped, etc. the vibe, the torrent, the montana, etc. So in a nutshell this is the lineup I propose:

Solstice
Lemans (G5)
Grand Am (G6)
Grand Prixf
Firebird

Also do away with that horribly overused kidney grill. Maybe base all the front ends off the Bandit.

I'm just talking about a division of high performance vehicles, like Pontiac used to be in the 70's. Maybe offer all coupes, no 4 doors.

I know its completly different, but GM allready has Saturn and Chevy to please statistics and bean counters. If they re-did pontiac in this way, it would be something completly different for the market, and it would work! everywhere people would be talking about "the new pontiac" They were GM's performance division once, make it the performance division again! Really at this point, its either do something similar to my idea, or let Pontiac go down the path Oldsmobile did...

[Ant]

Originally Posted by Cormaster

especially bringing it back as a poor mans BMW sports car!

I guess poor people like reliability.

[Pontiac Ninja]

I like how you think Cormaster. But it doesn't look good for them bringing back the Firebird at this point after the article I posted. BUt I'm going to get an '01 or '02 Trans-Am WS6 anyways in the next 4-6 months. So, hopefully by the time I actually get a BRAND NEW muscle car in like 5-8 years, GM will have released a Firebird.

Originally Posted by 02andahalfgt

No, it's not 'far more than a rebadge'. They share the same drive train, same engine options and similar cheaply designed interiors.

I always thought of a rebadge as looking almost identicle as well, and these cars most certainly did not!!

Edit: Anyways, the GTO is going to have to carry a lot of weight on its shoulders for Pontiac if there is to be a new version in 08/09. Chysler has proven that RWD and power under the hood sells and has more than one model to satisfy a wide variety of buyers. Giving Chevy a Camaro w/o giving Pontiac a Firebird is like ordering a sandwich with one piece of bread...