California Court upholds $15M verdict against GM

[badassgrandam99]

...this makes me sick... this man fell asleep at the wheel and rolled his Chevy Blazer... the roof partially caved in the roll over and he ended up a quadripaligic... the courts said "this could've been prevented if GM spent a few extra bucks and used different roof rails" ...um... no... this could've been prevented if he didn't fall asleep at the wheel... where is the personal responsibility going in this country...

http://www.autonews.com/news.cms?newsId=4353

Everyone is out to make a buck these days. Actually, 15 million of them but anyway.... what do people expect cars to do today. Consider the following:

YOU design a 4000+ pound vehicle capable of propelling its occupants down the road at over 100 MPH. Now once you've accomplished this, try and design the vehicle so that it protects ALL passengers inside at speeds upwards of 55-65 MPH and then comes basically to a complete stop or rolls over one or more times. Sounds easy enough to me!

Now I'm not unsympathetic for this guys inuries. I can't even begin to imagine what my life would be like without the use of my limbs.... I certainly believe though that General Motors or ANY other vehicle manufacturer cannot account for the unlimited ways a vehicle can crash. It just simply isn't possible. Add in all the other factors of weather, other vehicles, objects striking the vehicle (fixed or moveable), driver physical shape and size, etc etc etc.... how in the hell could you possibly find GM at fault? Yes, they could have constructed the entire roof structure out of solid square 2" box tubing. Oh wait... then all the tree huggers would **** and moan that the truck only gets 13 MPG when their Hybrid Civic gets 53 MPG....

I would like to know if the people who voted on that jury (or the lawyers/judge for that matter) immediately went and traded in their General Motors SUV or car. If not, they are complete hypocrits by awarding this guy money for his own stupidity. If it was deemed to be an unsafe vehicle by the jury then they shouldn't have felt safe in their vehicles and immediately traded them in on a M1-A1 Abrams tank. About the only vehicle you could travel in and NOT be injured by stupid circumstance.

I agree with BAGA on this.... what happened to responsibility for your own actions. [sarcasm]"Oh look at me! Look at me! I went out and drank 1/2 a keg of beer, popped a little ecstasy followed by some crack and then smashed my car into a schoolbus at 120 MPH. It's all GM's fault that the brakes didn't stop me in time and that my car exploded causing me to suffer burns and a broken neck!". [/sarcasm]

[Mike3800]

I agree the fault of him being injured is his for falling asleep behind the wheel, however I do agree with the fact that they should make the vehicle safer. A rollbar is not much to ask for in design ya know. Kinda like if he'd fallen asleep behind the wheel and the seatbelt didn't work because of a design flaw... yeah it's the guys fault for falling asleep, but accidents do happen and we do have laws that car mfg's must abide by in building vehicles for saftey. So I don't completley disagree with the courts findings, he would not have been injured as extensivley if GM had of spend a few more bucks on the roof design it is true, even if it was his fault that he crashed. Follow what I am saying? Kinda like the exploding gas tank thing that GM got out of paying for... true, accidents are caused by people but the gas tank should not cause an explosion in a 30MPH impact!!

[badassgrandam99]

...however... GM was in compliance with all laws... the vehicle was built meeting all gov't standards... remember that Dateline NBC had to rig it's GM pickup to explode for the cameras... Dan is right with this... you can't build a car for every possible scenario... what if GM did use different roof rails, well then it could be possible that if the car crashed in a different manner that the roof rail could end up breaking in such a manner that IT could do injury or damage to the driver or passenger... my main problem is that this guy does not need 15 million for his accident... it was his fault... this is along the lines of suing gun manufacturers in my opinion for a criminal using a gun... lawsuits in this country are getting out of hand and it ends up coming back hurt all of us in the end cuz prices of our cars and everything else will go up....

[Kitt]

california is notorious for having stupid court descisions ruins it for the rest of the country

[Mike3800]

Originally posted by badassgrandam99
... my main problem is that this guy does not need 15 million for his accident... it was his fault... this is along the lines of suing gun manufacturers in my opinion for a criminal using a gun... lawsuits in this country are getting out of hand and it ends up coming back hurt all of us in the end cuz prices of our cars and everything else will go up....

I agree with the lawsuits thing (too many/rediculous) but I still think the guy has a bit of a point. It was defective even if it supposedly was built according to US regs etc..., it did not hold up the way it should have been even if the accident (accidents are always someone's fault) was his fault. And the gas tank thing was a real problem, even if the news pumped it up to me more than it was.

It's not just GM it's all car mfg that I have a beef with not taking responisibility for the things they build. they don't want to do warranty work. The don't want to do recalls, they don't want to do service etc... Look at the Ford/Firestone thing... neither big company wanted to take the hit!! Ford should have sued Firestone, and Ford should have replaced the tires (not Firestone) FORD bought and FORD put on their cars and decided were safe, then Ford collect from Firestone. Ford must have had some good lawers.

These big corps need to learn the public won't stand for buying defective goods, I am glad to see " middle class Joe Guy" win against Big Corp 100 million lawer strong big corperation, even if the ammount was excessive, stilll he has no use of his limbs and the ammount might have made a little dent in GM, in other words, like me paying a 100 dollar fine.

Also, not flamming you or being unpersonable, but I think your analogy is not related to the lawsuit. It would be more like a crimminal holding up a bank and using a gun, firing it and the gun malfunctions and blows his hand off, then the crimminal sues the gun manufacturer for selling a defective gun. Well... that's closer but still not the same LOL!!! Oh well, just wanted to point out that ther is another side.

[VTECSiGAH8R]

I would never trade the use of my limbs and bodily functions for $15 million. In reality, SUVs are unsafe, and there is no way around it. If GM wanted to, they could have had a safety measure in place but they didn't do it probably because of costs to compete with Ford. GM is doing the same thing now. The Transportation safety guy admits that he would never buy his daugter an American SUV, even if it was the last car on earth, so GM said they would put in side-top airbags, but only if the other truckmakers do it too. Yes, the guy fell asleep, but many people bought SUVs under the false notion that they are safer, when in fact they roll much easier and the roofs aren't supported as much as cars are (with respect to weight of course). Basically, if it was a Honda Civic/Accord or a Subaru Impreza, he would have probably been OK because those companies spend a lot of money to change their safety designs for the better. But it isn't really a fair comparison since those aren't SUVs but you get my point.

BTW, $15 million is chump change to GM. They had to pay $4.9 BILLION a few years ago to a family of 6 that got severe burns all over their body because their 1979 Chevy Malibu station wagon gas tank exploded after a DRUNK DRIVER rear-ended them at 50-70 mph. I felt sorry for them, but I also was disgusted because the amount was so great when it was the DRUNK DRIVER's fault that the accident happened in the first place and they were lucky to be alive. Most of the damages were punitive however, and I guess they don't have o pay them or something, still unclear on that??

Lawsuits are getting out of hand tho seriously: http://www.inq7.net/wnw/2002/mar/22/wnw_4-1.htm

How can someone think that harassment is worth anywhere near a billion dollars, let alone $7.4 billion dollars for 450 people?? That crap ****es me off.

[VTECSiGAH8R]

This is a really good site that really shows you how much CRAP goes through our legal system DAILY: www.overlawyered.com

Makes me sick only reading one day's worth of lawsuits and rewards for lawsuits.

[Mike3800]

Originally posted by VTECSiGAH8R
I would never trade the use of my limbs and bodily functions for $15 million.

No one in their right mind would for any ammount of money.

I still think the ammount in this case was not excessive because it's more of a "punishment/fine" for GM than it is a compensation for the guy losing his limbs, no ammount of money is worth that. Also I wouldn't go that far to say it's "chump change" for GM, true that it's not much for them (kinda like me paying a 50 dollar fine) but enough for them to take notice!!!

I'm not going to read all the posts right now but I do think that Rollbars should be a standard in any vehicle. Just my opinion though. I do know that it would cost a little bit more but still...

[Gimli]

You know what, if the vehicule was unsafe he should sue the department of transportation who desings the safety tests. It's THEIR responsibility to make sure the vehicules are safe.

Maybe he'll make another few million bucks there...

Maybe he should sue the other motorist who barely avoided the dumbass sleeping in his SUV for not hitting him and keeping him from rolling over...

Some people's stupidity never ceases to amaze me...

Maybe my reasoning is way off here but think of this for a second. Name another manufacturer of a specific product that crash tests their product and says you'll be safe using this equipment.

Imagine if you will your Grand Am stripped of all sheet metal, crumple zones, anything not really necessary to supplying safety to the occupant(s). Now imagine if you drove the vehicle in this condition as you normally do. As most of us would find out we would get to and from our destinations safely without running into something or something running into us. So why does the car manufacturer even provide this? In the name of safety of course. They make attempts to provide not only a fuel efficient vehicle but a vehicle that is safe, reliable, comfortable, enjoyable, and affordable (in general).

Show me where it says "General Motors GUARANTEES you will be safe in a rollover accident going 50 MPH after you've fallen asleep and your head is practically resting against the steering wheel".

General Motors (and all other car manufacturers) will TRY to provide a safe vehicle. In reality their product is engineered and tested to be driven WITHOUT running into other objects or other objects running into it. THAT is considered "usual" use in my opinion. Would it not be for human error (falling asleep at the wheel, driving drunk) there would be no need for these MASSIVE safety features to be implemented because the cars would never be put into circumstances where they would need to protect to that degree.

General Motors meets the guidelines set forth by the government standards. To find them at fault even after they have met all rules and regulations AND the driver of the vehicle falling asleep is completely beyond my comprehension. If anything the guy should have gotten a ticket for failure to control his vehicle and nothing more.

I simply cannot understand how anyone could sit there and say "You know, he's right! Why didn't GM build the roof stronger so that when he fell asleep at the wheel and then rolled the vehicle onto its roof it didn't cave?! I mean, cars are expected to be on their roof in the first place not with the wheels on the ground."

To put this in perspective for some of you from my point of view...
I think I'm going to go and stick my hand in my blender. After I turn it on and hack all my fingers off I'll go sue the manufacturer for not putting in a sensor to detect that my fingers were there. What's that? Misuse of their product? What exactly do you call turning a vehicle upside down? That's clear enough for me.

I'm generally for the little guy beating out the large corporation... I am not for them when they try and get there through stupidity.

[Mike3800]

Originally posted by Dan00GPGT
To find them at fault even after they have met all rules and regulations AND the driver of the vehicle falling asleep is completely beyond my comprehension.

So.... basically no car mfg can be at fault for saftery equip if the meet all regs etc...?

What about the Pinto in the 70's? That passed. What about the Suzuki Samari for rollover? That passed too...

no... I wholeheartedly disagree. Having a car accident is not misuse of a car, a car is supposed to be designed to crash and protect the passangers. If I die at a head on from a 15MPH impact collision (2 cars going 7.5MPH), doesn't matter who's at fault with who caused the accident, death at 15MPH as a result of injuries sustained by the collision would be an issue with the car mfg, even if it supposedly met all gov. regs etc.... Follow yet?

Saftey in mfg cars is not a bonus, it is a mandatory and essencial part of building a car, next emissions/EPA, whearas reliability and performance follow a very, very distant 3rd place. If the car is determined to not be safe and protect the passangers to a resonable extenst (rollovers are more common than you think) and supposedly has met all gov standards, then it needs to be re-designed, recalled and any damages to persons or property as a result should be quickly compensated.

[Gimli]

I forgot one...

He should also sue the music station he was listening to when he fell asleep for playing such boring music. Maybe the artist too for performing the song in the first place.

Lots of money to make there...

You knwo what too? Maybe he wasn't wearing his seat belt and that's what caused his injuries. He could prolly get another $15M because GM designed their cars so that you don't have to wear your seat belt to drive it. How many of you would like for the car to shut off if you don't have your belt on?

[Mike3800]

Originally posted by Gimli
I forgot one...

He should also sue the music station he was listening to when he fell asleep for playing such boring music. Maybe the artist too for performing the song in the first place.

Lots of money to make there...

You knwo what too? Maybe he wasn't wearing his seat belt and that's what caused his injuries. He could prolly get another $15M because GM designed their cars so that you don't have to wear your seat belt to drive it. How many of you would like for the car to shut off if you don't have your belt on?

I know... what an idot... imagine driving a car and thinking it's safe in a collision... what idiot buys a car and thinks of how it will react in an accident!!!

[Watch4MyBu]

My girlfriends father is a judge and i mentioned this to him and even he said it is ridiculous

[Mike3800]

Originally posted by Watch4MyBu
My girlfriends father is a judge and i mentioned this to him and even he said it is ridiculous

I am sure you had an un-bias opionon and presented it to him in that manner. LOL!!!

[Watch4MyBu]

I told him just what it said in the post and he agreed with me. There is not much to really thing about. You fal lasleep and then sue the car maker for your stupidity. That makes sense. There is not responsibility for ones actions anymore

[Mike3800]

Originally posted by Watch4MyBu
I told him just what it said in the post and he agreed with me. There is not much to really thing about. You fal lasleep and then sue the car maker for your stupidity. That makes sense. There is not responsibility for ones actions anymore

So in that case the car manufacturer can NEVER be at fault for failing saftey equipment since in 99% of all car accidents, there is a person at fault?

[Watch4MyBu]

What do you make cars or something. The guy fel lasleep at the wheel. If you are that irresponsible with a vehicle don't get behind the wheel because things can happen. That is the problem hehe. Everybody wants to pass the blame. Oh wait..maybe you are a lawyer and this is how you make your money