Remove the PCV system for performance?

[eric99gt]

Originally Posted by AaronGTR

Not necessarily no. Since some of those things are combustible as a fuel source, you have absolutely no idea if taking them away adds or subtracts power. It is pure speculation.



WRONGWRONGWRONG!!!

AS I AND MANY OTHERS HERE HAVE TOLD YOU REPEATEDLY THERE ARE VERY REAL AND POSSIBLE NEGATIVE EFFECTS OF THIS. IT HAS BEEN DOCUMENTED MANY TIMES OVER IN NUMEROUS RESEARCH BY AUTOMOTIVE MANUFACTURERS AND INDEPENDENT LABORITORIES. Wake up and smell the coffee!!!!!!!!

May be an idiot question aaron, but why is it bad? What are the actual effects of venting these gases instead of putting them back through the engine?

[silvergtjrad]

You guys have different opinions, and different reasons to back them up. Milzy has personal experience and Aaron has research hes read about. Every time you two disagree on something it turns into a giant pissing match.

[lvemy3100]

the problem milzy keeps neglecting to address is the fact that you need a vaccum source to properly evacuate the gases... just having breathers on your valve covers WILL NOT allow these gases to properly vent...

I am sure many of you have seen me dissagree with Aaron on things in the past but this for sure something that we do agree on...

[xonelith]

Originally Posted by lvemy3100

the problem milzy keeps neglecting to address is the fact that you need a vaccum source to actually properly evacuate the gases... just having breathers on your valve covers WILL NOT allow these gases to properly vent...

I am sure many of you have seen me dissagree with Aaron on things in the past but this for sure something that we do agree on...

Will using one of those catch cans from Jegs solve the problem? Fix both arguments? Or is the best approach to go back to a stock setup. At this point, i'm not sure which way will be cheaper for me to adopt.

[MilzyZ34]

Originally Posted by lvemy3100

the problem milzy keeps neglecting to address is the fact that you need a vaccum source to properly evacuate the gases... just having breathers on your valve covers WILL NOT allow these gases to properly vent...

I am sure many of you have seen me dissagree with Aaron on things in the past but this for sure something that we do agree on...

why do you absolutely have to have vacuum if the crankcase is always under pressure?

[lvemy3100]

I didnt see any on Jegs.com...

you can find them usually in 9mm and 15mm hose sizings... I cant reccomend any place for one but the pricing seems to be around $50-$150 depending on where you go and the brand you buy...

I saw some for cheap on ebay but I dont think I would really trust them...

[Blackbombshell9]

I'd go back to stock Tim.

[lvemy3100]

Originally Posted by MilzyZ34

why do you absolutely have to have vacuum if the crankcase is always under pressure?

because there is very little to no pressure... so you MUST use a vaccum source to PROPERLY evacuate the gasses



like Aarron said before

THERE ARE VERY REAL AND POSSIBLE NEGATIVE EFFECTS OF THIS. IT HAS BEEN DOCUMENTED MANY TIMES OVER IN NUMEROUS RESEARCH BY AUTOMOTIVE MANUFACTURERS AND INDEPENDENT LABORITORIES.

if you could find a way to get all the gasses out without a vaccum source that would be fantastic but really there isnt any way to do so effectively and so we are stuck having to run a simple oil catch can system... OH NO


EDIT: you can even be a real cheap ass and use a MP5138 Cambell Hausfeld compressor filter...

[MilzyZ34]

Originally Posted by lvemy3100

because there is very little to no pressure... so you MUST use a vaccum source to PROPERLY evacuate the gasses



like Aarron said before


if you could find a way to get all the gasses out without a vaccum source that would be fantastic but really there isnt any way to do so effectively and so we are stuck having to run a simple oil catch can system... OH NO


EDIT: you can even be a real cheap ass and use a MP5138 Cambell Hausfeld compressor filter...

so exactly how much pressure do you think you need to have for these gases to escape?

I'm not against having a catch-can. We just didn't have it in the budget for Tim's car this time around. I still wouldn't plumb it into the intake manifold though.

[xonelith]

Originally Posted by lvemy3100

I didnt see any on Jegs.com...

you can find them usually in 9mm and 15mm hose sizings... I cant reccomend any place for one but the pricing seems to be around $50-$150 depending on where you go and the brand you buy...

I saw some for cheap on ebay but I dont think I would really trust them...

This one was posted earlier on in the thread:

Originally Posted by O1GAGT

I agree, any reason a catch can wasn't used?
Something like this would work well: http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...10002_69732_-1

Once i decide whether or not to replace the UIM and go back to stock, or just buy a catch can, I will probably start another thread to ensure I have installed it correctly (ie pipe both front & rear valve cover to remote catch can...etc).

Thanks everyone, and thanks Mike for making long-lasting parts

[lvemy3100]

Originally Posted by MilzyZ34

....
I'm not against having a catch-can. We just didn't have it in the budget for Tim's car this time around.

umm like I posted before... it would have cost $20 total per can if you used the cheap route which would have been much better than what you did...

Originally Posted by MilzyZ34

....I still wouldn't plumb it into the intake manifold though.

so where the hell would you plumb it to?

[MilzyZ34]

Originally Posted by lvemy3100

umm like I posted before... it would have cost $20 total per can if you used the cheap route which would have been much better than what you did...



so where the hell would you plumb it to?

This is he catch-can i would use, the same one I installed on the Stage 3 car ... http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...46735_-1_10475 . As you can see, it has only one nipple on it, which I would plumb both valvecovers into. The top is vented to atmosphere. Doing it this way costs around $300 in parts, but is a nice setup.

[Sprucegagt]

Originally Posted by MilzyZ34

This is he catch-can i would use, the same one I installed on the Stage 3 car ... http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...46735_-1_10475 . As you can see, it has only one nipple on it, which I would plumb both valvecovers into. The top is vented to atmosphere. Doing it this way costs around $300 in parts, but is a nice setup.

When you add boost, this entire arguement becomes null and void. Let's try keeping it to just N/A vehicles.

[lvemy3100]

Originally Posted by MilzyZ34

This is he catch-can i would use, the same one I installed on the Stage 3 car ... http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...46735_-1_10475 . As you can see, it has only one nipple on it, which I would plumb both valvecovers into. The top is vented to atmosphere. Doing it this way costs around $300 in parts, but is a nice setup.

since you still arent getting it and I am sick of repeating what has already been saidby myself and others I will refer you to my previous post and be done with this thread... http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/showp...2&postcount=60

[xonelith]

Originally Posted by Sprucegagt

When you add boost, this entire arguement becomes null and void. Let's try keeping it to just N/A vehicles.

He's talking about his Stage 3 NA car I think.... so I believe he is still on topic.

[MilzyZ34]

Originally Posted by lvemy3100

since you still arent getting it and I am sick of repeating what has already been saidby myself and others I will refer you to my previous post and be done with this thread... http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/showp...2&postcount=60

That's funny b/c I had the same feeling of having to repeat myself over and over. Lets just agree to disagree so we can put this to bed. We've both said what we had to say.

[AaronGTR]

Originally Posted by MilzyZ34

so exactly how much pressure do you think you need to have for these gases to escape?

I'm not against having a catch-can. We just didn't have it in the budget for Tim's car this time around. I still wouldn't plumb it into the intake manifold though.

So, without plumbing it to the intake manifold, how exactly are you going to get any vacuum to pull stuff through the pcv?

Originally Posted by Sprucegagt

When you add boost, this entire arguement becomes null and void. Let's try keeping it to just N/A vehicles.

What do you mean it becomes null and void. Um, hello... I'm boosted and I still have a pcv system. The hose goes to the S/C inlet behind the throttle body so it still gets vacuum and never sees boost. If you had a centrifugal S/C or turbo with the TB still on the intake manifold, you should still be able to leave the pcv connected to the mani and put a check valve in the line. I'm sure there's a way to make it work. Just look at all the factory turbo cars out there.

[Sprucegagt]

Originally Posted by AaronGTR

What do you mean it becomes null and void. Um, hello... I'm boosted and I still have a pcv system. The hose goes to the S/C inlet behind the throttle body so it still gets vacuum and never sees boost. If you had a centrifugal S/C or turbo with the TB still on the intake manifold, you should still be able to leave the pcv connected to the mani and put a check valve in the line. I'm sure there's a way to make it work. Just look at all the factory turbo cars out there.

Like I said, if you're adding boost then the arguement is pointless. You're setup does not allow the PCV to see boost ever, so it doesn't apply to you.

Adding a check valve to the PCV line would only make the vent tube pressurized when in WOT. Anyway boost engines normally have a higher than normal amount of blowby. This results in only exagerating the problem.

[MilzyZ34]

Originally Posted by Sprucegagt

Like I said, if you're adding boost then the arguement is pointless. You're setup does not allow the PCV to see boost ever, so it doesn't apply to you.

Adding a check valve to the PCV line would only make the vent tube pressurized when in WOT. Anyway boost engines normally have a higher than normal amount of blowby. This results in only exagerating the problem.

The Stage 3 car I'm referring to was the daily-driven Stage 3 NA car.

with more blowby comes more crankcase pressure which helps my case. Don't forget that the stage 2 package will reduce the amount of vacuum b/c of the cam, and the added compression increases the pressure in the cylinders which would in turn increase crankcase pressure.

[SpyhunteR]

Originally Posted by Sprucegagt

Like I said, if you're adding boost then the arguement is pointless. You're setup does not allow the PCV to see boost ever, so it doesn't apply to you.

Adding a check valve to the PCV line would only make the vent tube pressurized when in WOT. Anyway boost engines normally have a higher than normal amount of blowby. This results in only exagerating the problem.

which is why I routed it into the atmosphere.

This argument is absolutely stupid. To be quite honest I've seen many cars where it was disabled, and to where they were not.

I know on my car if I had it hooked up N/A or boosted, in time the oil build up would be rediculous to the point where the intake ports would be smaller from all the crud. Just so damn dirty.