Tranny Fortification... info inside

jaketuff · 11-05-2002, 11:55 AM

I am researching the means to bulletproof (or at least beebe proof) the 4t45e. Here is what I have found so far....

www.bulkparts.com : They sell rebuild kits and offer a variety of performance upgrades for most GM FWD Transmissions. They do not list the 4t45e, but I assumed the 4t40e would have similar parts. To ensure this, I emailed the support staff. Here is the correspondence....

The catalogs all show the 4T40E and the 4T45E as using the same parts. 1995-1999
I have no new data on the parts after 1999

Mark

Jaketuff wrote:

Hello,
I see that you have a variety of parts and rebuild kits for the GM fwd transmissions. I do not see the 4t45E listed, it is the application used in the Aleros, Grand Ams, Malibus. I am running a lot of power thru the tranny in my SC'ed Grand Am GT. I have about 260HP going thru it, and about 235lbs-ft of torque.

I am right on the limit of the capacity of the tranny. I have a cooler on it, and run Royal Purple. But I am pretty sure that it will pop sooner or later. What do you have that is compatible with this application. I believe it is similar in build t the 4t40E, used in the older Grand Ams and other n-bodies.

*WHAT DOES EVERYONE THINK??? Building a Performance 4t453, not cheap, I know, but share some know-how...

JOUT

Watch4MyBu · 11-05-2002, 12:18 PM

Level ten is in New Jersey and they are really good. I know they aren't cheap but I would contact them if I were you

jaketuff · 11-05-2002, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by joefish2002
Level ten is in New Jersey and they are really good. I know they aren't cheap but I would contact them if I were you

Level Ten, I once saw a car with their stickers locally... I have read that they are not all they are, cracked, up to be. It seems like their 4t65e's seem to blow after being "built" by them.

Intense seems like the bet 4t65e, better than the SLP. Unfortunately, neither of those companies have anything for us... yet.

Pat

Watch4MyBu · 11-05-2002, 01:23 PM

That's odd because I have heard nothing but good things about them. What about doinga 4t65-e swap and using the hd from intense performance. There is some custom issues like the pcm calibration and the drive axles but it probably is not that hard being that most n-body concepts use this transmission

jaketuff · 11-05-2002, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by joefish2002
That's odd because I have heard nothing but good things about them. What about doinga 4t65-e swap and using the hd from intense performance. There is some custom issues like the pcm calibration and the drive axles but it probably is not that hard being that most n-body concepts use this transmission

Awaiting a groundbreaker to do this swap. My car is a total daily rider right now so downtime is slight. There is a LOT of custom PCM ork to do with the swap...

Hmmm, I will post a poll over on Clubgp about the Level Ten guys... I emailed L10 once and they never replied. Oh well, hopefully some owners will give us the real deal... http://www.clubgp.com/forum/link.asp?TOPIC_ID=6429965

Level 10 Discussion
The GOOD
Sounds impressive, albeit expensive!

The BAD!
Part 1 CLubGP, regarding shipping, service, a lawuit?
Part 2 The Ugly... $4,000 POS
Part 3 The Resolution

BTW - A used 4t45e (around 10k) 3.29 averages $650 at salvage.

*I will see what Instense can do also.

Pat

Watch4MyBu · 11-05-2002, 01:49 PM

I guess the good thing for us is that if we have a problem we can drive there to sove the problem. I have heard of some other good places. Let me find them

Watch4MyBu · 11-05-2002, 01:55 PM

http://www.protechtransmissions.com/...mancekits.html

jaketuff · 11-05-2002, 02:49 PM

It looks like they have a performace division and a standard repair division. I called them a few moments ago, looks like the Performance guys are there from 8AM to 4PM EST.

1-866-776-8321 (1-866-PROTEC1)

Here is a sample of what they claim to do... They also do the whole 9 yards, rebuilds, upgrades, TCs, etc.

1. The Pro-Tech Performance Computer Chip Upgrade Kit

Our upgrade kit features the following:
Maximize performance
Increases your vehicle's power up to 90 hp
Increases Torque up to 200 ft-lb.
Gives you control over the Rev-Limiter and Speed-Limiter
Easy installation - Our plug and Play installation process plugs into the service Port on the Drive-line Computer
Precise control over shift firmness
Corrections for various Rear-end Strategies
Optimization of the converter lock-up strategy
Compensation for Tire-Size upgrades

Unlike their competitors, they offer part throttle and open-wide throttle position tuning, not just wide open throttle.
All of their products are thoroughly dyno tested as well as tested on the street to get the maximum performance possible.
All Pro-Tech Performance Chips are tailor made for your specific computer code. They do not offer "generic" chips made for all similar vehicles. They also don't make "off the shelf" chips.

****Looks good I will call them in the morning and see what they can do for the 4t45e, and 65 Joe.

They are in the NY area, just outsde of Westchester County - Harriman, NY.

JOUT

Watch4MyBu · 11-05-2002, 02:59 PM

Let us know what they say.

mfuller · 11-05-2002, 03:18 PM

Man, I hope you guys find something....I'm not sure how long this sucker will hold together....

Doug · 11-05-2002, 06:06 PM

Scott from intense lives/works right down the street from me. I have already asked him about the tranny and he said he wants to stick to Grand Prixs. I'll bug him some more though

Also he rebuild my friends GTP tranny and its pretty sweet

jsos431 · 11-05-2002, 06:41 PM

you can check out netgearhead.com. they have a lot of things for many many transmissions.

jaketuff · 11-06-2002, 01:47 PM

Pro-Tech Performance

Okay I spoke with Sean at Pro-Tech Performance. They seemed professional and very responsive to all my questions. Sean has worked at Level 10 and mentioned that he was not happy with their srupulous business and had to change. I spoke with him for about a half hour. He mentioned he was working right now on a torque convertor and a valve body for a 1999 GAGT.

Here are the specs...

1. Performance Transmission Rebuild $2995
Clutch Packs
Kevlar Bands
Valve Body - Custom Built Unit
....6 months unlimited mileage warranty.
"This will hold 400lbs-ft of torque.... It will drop about 2-3 tenths off of your 1/4 mile NA, and oh sc'ed it will give you about a .5 second." 6 hours of install time.

2. Torque Converter $565
Essentially this is meant to allow the higher throttle launches and really give you a snap of the neck from your torque.

3. Posi-discs $699
This will get rid of the one-wheel burnout and will allow you a more consistent launch.

Total - $,$$$
A. Do everything on the list and labor is free, final cost = $4,250
B. Do just each part and the labor is $62/hr (labor is about 6 hours for the tranny rebuild, 4 hours for each other job.)

*I will go see this shop soon.

Pat

Craig99SE2 · 11-06-2002, 02:23 PM

What about the chip? I don't plan on generating crazy horsepower, but a chip that bumps line pressure, etc. would do it for me. Not going ASE because it is non-configureable and DHP is dragging their feet...

jaketuff · 11-06-2002, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Craig99SE2
What about the chip? I don't plan on generating crazy horsepower, but a chip that bumps line pressure, etc. would do it for me. Not going ASE because it is non-configureable and DHP is dragging their feet...

I would wait for DHP, they are working on it now. They will be done soon with the NA spec. It is less of a challenge to create than the chip for the SCed Cars. It is probable that it will be cheaper than other producers as well.

JOUT

aleroboy · 11-06-2002, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaketuff

"This will hold 400lbs-ft of torque.... It will drop about 2-3 tenths off of your 1/4 mile NA, and oh sc'ed it will give you about a .5 second." 6 hours of install time.

only 400 ft/lbs?

I'm at 360 on juice now

time to call them.

bszopi · 11-07-2002, 08:13 AM

Very interesting... but I'd rather try to spend $4k on converting to a 5-spd than keeping a 4-spd auto. But it is definately something to keep in mind. Since you mentioned they are trying to keep with the GTPs (or whatever), does this mean only the 4T65-e, or perhaps the 4T45-e? In other words, they don't plan on messing with the older 4T60-e's? I don't blame them, but it kinda sucks for me.....

jaketuff · 11-07-2002, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bszopi
Very interesting... but I'd rather try to spend $4k on converting to a 5-spd than keeping a 4-spd auto. But it is definately something to keep in mind. Since you mentioned they are trying to keep with the GTPs (or whatever), does this mean only the 4T65-e, or perhaps the 4T45-e? In other words, they don't plan on messing with the older 4T60-e's? I don't blame them, but it kinda sucks for me.....

The gents over at Intense are concentrating on the 4t65e. We are still lobbying for some help there for the 4t45.

Pro-Tech WILL DO the 4t45e, and prices are listed. Rather high, but hell, it is probably a lot easier and strong enough when you price out a 4t65e swap... But for the manual swap, I don't know really.

They rate the 4t45e as capable of a 400lbs-ft load. The 4t65e swap would probably be futile when going after such torque.

JOUT

aleroboy · 11-07-2002, 11:46 AM

If my stock tranny has taken my abuse I'm sure the 400 ft/lb rated one will be jsut fine.
As for going to a manual. I'd like to do it but don't want to mess with all that crap. I could get it to work and prolly for less than 4k, however with nitrous, an auto works out better. Also on really fast cars the manual begins to hold you back.
If I really wanted a manual I'd buy a alero GL4 and go turbo.
Then just swap that 287 out for a 282. A V6 manual would be cool but to me it's not worth my effort at this time. Maybe in the furure, maybe a customers car. first we would have to see if DHP could do anything for us on a manual swap. if not then I'd look into a stand alone.

GTManiac · 11-07-2002, 03:24 PM

wow I just drooled all over the place with all of this manual talk. Maybe summer-time next year if I am done with everything by then. We'll see.

11-05-2002, 11:55 AM	#1
jaketuff GAGT - Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Westchester, NY Age: 43 Posts: 2,093 Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT Coupe	Tranny Fortification... info inside I am researching the means to bulletproof (or at least beebe proof) the 4t45e. Here is what I have found so far.... www.bulkparts.com : They sell rebuild kits and offer a variety of performance upgrades for most GM FWD Transmissions. They do not list the 4t45e, but I assumed the 4t40e would have similar parts. To ensure this, I emailed the support staff. Here is the correspondence.... The catalogs all show the 4T40E and the 4T45E as using the same parts. 1995-1999 I have no new data on the parts after 1999 Mark Jaketuff wrote: Hello, I see that you have a variety of parts and rebuild kits for the GM fwd transmissions. I do not see the 4t45E listed, it is the application used in the Aleros, Grand Ams, Malibus. I am running a lot of power thru the tranny in my SC'ed Grand Am GT. I have about 260HP going thru it, and about 235lbs-ft of torque. I am right on the limit of the capacity of the tranny. I have a cooler on it, and run Royal Purple. But I am pretty sure that it will pop sooner or later. What do you have that is compatible with this application. I believe it is similar in build t the 4t40E, used in the older Grand Ams and other n-bodies. WHAT DOES EVERYONE THINK??? Building a Performance 4t453, not cheap, I know, but share some know-how... JOUT __________________ 2000 Pontiac Grand Am GT Coupe* Magnacharger SC February 2003 N-body of the Month 14.34 @ 93.38MPH Eaton SC, No ported heads, No Juice! -RETIRED March 2010 w/165k- 2013 Mercedes ML350 !ACHTUNG! Es ist Shtock 2005 Infiniti G35 Coupe : CAI, Manifold Spacer 2004 Pontiac GTO : Mild Mods, and Tuned ... 13.1 @ 107.5 PB 1992 Mustang LX : TT, 351, IC, Alky, Gears - 400HP/500lbs-ft ... MONSTER 1991 Mustang GT : GT40 H/I, Bullitt Wheels, New Paint

11-05-2002, 02:49 PM	#8
jaketuff GAGT - Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Westchester, NY Age: 43 Posts: 2,093 Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT Coupe	Excellent Find!!! It looks like they have a performace division and a standard repair division. I called them a few moments ago, looks like the Performance guys are there from 8AM to 4PM EST. 1-866-776-8321 (1-866-PROTEC1) Here is a sample of what they claim to do... They also do the whole 9 yards, rebuilds, upgrades, TCs, etc. 1. The Pro-Tech Performance Computer Chip Upgrade Kit Our upgrade kit features the following: Maximize performance Increases your vehicle's power up to 90 hp Increases Torque up to 200 ft-lb. Gives you control over the Rev-Limiter and Speed-Limiter Easy installation - Our plug and Play installation process plugs into the service Port on the Drive-line Computer Precise control over shift firmness Corrections for various Rear-end Strategies Optimization of the converter lock-up strategy Compensation for Tire-Size upgrades Unlike their competitors, they offer part throttle and open-wide throttle position tuning, not just wide open throttle. All of their products are thoroughly dyno tested as well as tested on the street to get the maximum performance possible. All Pro-Tech Performance Chips are tailor made for your specific computer code. They do not offer "generic" chips made for all similar vehicles. They also don't make "off the shelf" chips. ****Looks good I will call them in the morning and see what they can do for the 4t45e, and 65 Joe. They are in the NY area, just outsde of Westchester County - Harriman, NY. JOUT

11-05-2002, 03:18 PM	#10
mfuller Mr. Common Sense AKA: Matt Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Loves Park, IL USA Age: 47 Posts: 2,031 Vehicle: 2000 Alero GLS sedan	Man, I hope you guys find something....I'm not sure how long this sucker will hold together.... __________________ Matt - Resident brake and suspension guru Also, your friendly Performance and Technical Moderator *Please don't tailgate, text and drive, drink and drive, or otherwise act like an asshat.* Questioning if it will ever run again.....

11-05-2002, 06:06 PM	#11
Doug Hairdryer Power Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Dublin, OH Age: 36 Posts: 623 Vehicle: 2000 SE-T	Scott from intense lives/works right down the street from me. I have already asked him about the tranny and he said he wants to stick to Grand Prixs. I'll bug him some more though Also he rebuild my friends GTP tranny and its pretty sweet __________________ http://www.n-body.net/registry/yeahdoug/ 2000 Grand Am SE1 ex-turbo 1987 Supra Turbo 5 spd Targa 14.2 @100 with only I/E

11-06-2002, 01:47 PM	#13
jaketuff GAGT - Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Westchester, NY Age: 43 Posts: 2,093 Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT Coupe	Pro-Tech Performance Okay I spoke with Sean at Pro-Tech Performance. They seemed professional and very responsive to all my questions. Sean has worked at Level 10 and mentioned that he was not happy with their srupulous business and had to change. I spoke with him for about a half hour. He mentioned he was working right now on a torque convertor and a valve body for a 1999 GAGT. Here are the specs... 1. Performance Transmission Rebuild $2995 Clutch Packs Kevlar Bands Valve Body - Custom Built Unit ....6 months unlimited mileage warranty. "This will hold 400lbs-ft of torque.... It will drop about 2-3 tenths off of your 1/4 mile NA, and oh sc'ed it will give you about a .5 second." 6 hours of install time. 2. Torque Converter $565 Essentially this is meant to allow the higher throttle launches and really give you a snap of the neck from your torque. 3. Posi-discs $699 This will get rid of the one-wheel burnout and will allow you a more consistent launch. Total - $,$$$ A. Do everything on the list and labor is free, final cost = $4,250 B. Do just each part and the labor is $62/hr (labor is about 6 hours for the tranny rebuild, 4 hours for each other job.) I will go see this shop soon. Pat Last edited by jaketuff; 11-06-2002 at 02:02 PM.*

11-05-2002, 12:18 PM	#2
Watch4MyBu Lost Malibu Owner Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 493 Vehicle: 1998 Chevy Malibu	Level ten is in New Jersey and they are really good. I know they aren't cheap but I would contact them if I were you

11-05-2002, 01:23 PM	#4
Watch4MyBu Lost Malibu Owner Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 493 Vehicle: 1998 Chevy Malibu	That's odd because I have heard nothing but good things about them. What about doinga 4t65-e swap and using the hd from intense performance. There is some custom issues like the pcm calibration and the drive axles but it probably is not that hard being that most n-body concepts use this transmission

11-05-2002, 01:49 PM	#6
Watch4MyBu Lost Malibu Owner Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 493 Vehicle: 1998 Chevy Malibu	I guess the good thing for us is that if we have a problem we can drive there to sove the problem. I have heard of some other good places. Let me find them

11-05-2002, 01:55 PM	#7
Watch4MyBu Lost Malibu Owner Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 493 Vehicle: 1998 Chevy Malibu	http://www.protechtransmissions.com/...mancekits.html

11-05-2002, 02:59 PM	#9
Watch4MyBu Lost Malibu Owner Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 493 Vehicle: 1998 Chevy Malibu	Let us know what they say.

11-05-2002, 06:41 PM	#12
jsos431 GAGT - Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Ohio Age: 39 Posts: 124 Vehicle: 2001 Grand Am GT Coupe	you can check out netgearhead.com. they have a lot of things for many many transmissions.

11-06-2002, 02:23 PM	#14
Craig99SE2 Mr. Know It All AKA: Craig Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Commerce Twp., MI Age: 48 Posts: 1,349 Vehicle: 1999 Grand Am SE Coupe	What about the chip? I don't plan on generating crazy horsepower, but a chip that bumps line pressure, etc. would do it for me. Not going ASE because it is non-configureable and DHP is dragging their feet... __________________ Project 13-Second NA GASE - 1999 Grand Am SE - RSM Heads,UIM,LIM,62mm TB,AFE Filter,RSM WAI,TOGs,DynoMax Hi-Flo Cat,SLP,DynoMax,ASE Chip,Mobil 1,Accel DIS,Taylor Wires,Denso Iridium,Hyper Ground,FFP Pulley,B&M SuperCooler,RedLine D4 ATF,Poly Drivetrain Mounts - Estimated 250HP ... Dyno Charts Soon!

11-07-2002, 08:13 AM	#17
bszopi User account under probation AKA: Brad Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rogers, AR Age: 46 Posts: 1,391 Vehicle: 1989 Ford Mustang	Very interesting... but I'd rather try to spend $4k on converting to a 5-spd than keeping a 4-spd auto. But it is definately something to keep in mind. Since you mentioned they are trying to keep with the GTPs (or whatever), does this mean only the 4T65-e, or perhaps the 4T45-e? In other words, they don't plan on messing with the older 4T60-e's? I don't blame them, but it kinda sucks for me.....

11-07-2002, 11:46 AM	#19
aleroboy 340+ hp Club Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Colorado springs Age: 39 Posts: 1,854 Vehicle: 2001 Alero GLS coupe	If my stock tranny has taken my abuse I'm sure the 400 ft/lb rated one will be jsut fine. As for going to a manual. I'd like to do it but don't want to mess with all that crap. I could get it to work and prolly for less than 4k, however with nitrous, an auto works out better. Also on really fast cars the manual begins to hold you back. If I really wanted a manual I'd buy a alero GL4 and go turbo. Then just swap that 287 out for a 282. A V6 manual would be cool but to me it's not worth my effort at this time. Maybe in the furure, maybe a customers car. first we would have to see if DHP could do anything for us on a manual swap. if not then I'd look into a stand alone. __________________ really really slow right now.

11-07-2002, 03:24 PM	#20
GTManiac GDC is here Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Sterling Heights, MI Age: 40 Posts: 439 Vehicle: Yo	wow I just drooled all over the place with all of this manual talk. Maybe summer-time next year if I am done with everything by then. We'll see. __________________ My How-To Mod Site www.s10forum.com Greater Detroit Concepts

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