GM Voiding Powertrain Warranty on PCM Tuned Vehicles

[Mike Jung]

from: Warranty Void......

Originally Posted by ottawa_g8

Just a heads up to all who love to mod :-)

During a once a month presentation we get at the dealership from GM, this "wonderful" piece of news was dropped upon us...
Anytime we get a vehicle in with a powertrain component failure, we are to first verify the presence of genuine GM programming in various components...otherwise, GM will be cancelling the powertrain portion of your new car warranty effectively immediately...sucks...I know. Just a heads up for those getting ECM tunes, etc...This will now VOID the powertrain portion of your warranty...not sure if this is common practice in the US, but its now standard policy across north america...

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

I guess...I am going to wait after 5-years to tune my PCM

Discuss.

[PhantomLover007]

Just put you old one in when you take it to the shop..

[Mike Jung]

PS: Check this out...

Originally Posted by SpectreG8GT

The Intense Racing ECM tune is stealth as well, little known fact.

Originally Posted by GTPprix / Chris White

I have a bridge for sale as well, perhaps some swamp land in Florida? LOL

Originally Posted by Rogue from Intense Racing

Chris you don't need to be immature to make a point...

Hmm...I wonder why Chris White is being like that ?

Maybe because they FOCKED UP his GTP, have anything to do with it ?

That was just calling the pot black.

[nickofcourse]

i thought this was common knowledge?

[crazypontiac03]

Originally Posted by PhantomLover007

Just put you old one in when you take it to the shop..

Yea, That's what i did with my Silverado.

[notsoaveragej0e]

New corvettes log when you change the PCM, so even if you change it back they can see that it was changed, and you're SOL.

[nickofcourse]

i dont blame them, some people dont know how to tune so why should gm have to repair for some one focking their stuff up. If you overclock a factory comptuer chip and it takes a ****, should intel or amd have to send you a new one?

heh

[PhantomLover007]

Originally Posted by notsoaveragej0e

New corvettes log when you change the PCM, so even if you change it back they can see that it was changed, and you're SOL.

No worries about that. I'll never afford a Vette anyways..

[SpyhunteR]

Originally Posted by PhantomLover007

No worries about that. I'll never afford a Vette anyways..

what about one of those good rickety 80's beasts?

[SpyhunteR]

Originally Posted by Mike Jung

from: Warranty Void......



I guess...I am going to wait after 5-years to tune my PCM

Discuss.

This really isn't new news. Since OBD2 has been around, the dealerships have always been able to check what programming is in the vehicle.

[PhantomLover007]

Originally Posted by SpyhunteR

what about one of those good rickety 80's beasts?

IDK. Maybe one of those..

[ryanbgb22]

Alot of new cars are data logging now. Screw that.

[notsoaveragej0e]

Just gotta buy used and wait for the warranty to expire

[FastSteve]

Originally Posted by nickofcourse

i dont blame them, some people dont know how to tune so why should gm have to repair for some one focking their stuff up. If you overclock a factory comptuer chip and it takes a ****, should intel or amd have to send you a new one?

heh

What about people that use the "stock" tune from a hand held unit? Those companies put much time effort and money into being very sure that their performance tune isn't going to blow up your engine or anything like that. If I am not mistaken the auto maker has to have proof that the mod had a direct impact on the component failure. If my understanding is correct that means no auto maker can simply say your warranty is void just because you did this or that to your automobile. It has to be proven that the mod directly affected the failure of the parts. Meaning voiding someone powertrain warranty just because there was a tune is illegal. "IF I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY."

[black00gt1]

chris white is a doush

[99Alero_Boy]

Originally Posted by FastSteve

What about people that use the "stock" tune from a hand held unit? Those companies put much time effort and money into being very sure that their performance tune isn't going to blow up your engine or anything like that. If I am not mistaken the auto maker has to have proof that the mod had a direct impact on the component failure. If my understanding is correct that means no auto maker can simply say your warranty is void just because you did this or that to your automobile. It has to be proven that the mod directly affected the failure of the parts. Meaning voiding someone powertrain warranty just because there was a tune is illegal. "IF I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY."

that's what i thought too, with the magnuson-moss warranty act...

[plastic_indian]

This is as it should be. Modification of any parameter invalidates a warranty. While a particular tune may be demonstrably 'safe,' any change from stock opens the door to subjecting warranty claims to judgement calls. Judgement calls straddle that infamous 'thin grey line.' Black and white is, well, black and white (and stands up in court -- thin grey lines are a little harder...). While a conservative reprogram to my GA's fuel and/or spark map may be legitimately harmless to drivetrain longevity, we've now opened the door to the judgement call. Therefore, when Billy Bob drags his mud-caked, BullyDog'd, PowerChip'd super-dooper-pooper-scooper'd-up on 35's PowerJoke F350 into the dealer with a busted U-joint and screams 'warranty!," the precedent will have been set for the manufacturer to prove that Billy Bob's 'modifications' are responsible for the failure. Bullshat - hillbilly abused the truck, it broke, hillbilly pays the bill -- it's not FoMoCo's problem to prove liability.

[Malibu Glow]

look it's just another reason that GM comes up with to deny warranty coverage, what it really boils down to is GM doesn't want anyone messing with their stuff, if Gm had their way there'd be no way anyone could get any information from the PCM and you'd be forced to go to a dealer, it's been fought over for years with the aftermarket. For those who would care less about the warranty they'll do what they want with modifying thier ride adn know that anything that might be damaged won't be covered but that's with most modifiers anyway. I wouldn't be happy if I couldn't modify my vehicle whatever way I want. GM doesn't want to admit they could be wrong and that it might really be more the way the vehicle is operated rather than what tune is used in the PCM.

[FastSteve]

Originally Posted by plastic_indian

This is as it should be. Modification of any parameter invalidates a warranty. While a particular tune may be demonstrably 'safe,' any change from stock opens the door to subjecting warranty claims to judgement calls. Judgement calls straddle that infamous 'thin grey line.' Black and white is, well, black and white (and stands up in court -- thin grey lines are a little harder...). While a conservative reprogram to my GA's fuel and/or spark map may be legitimately harmless to drivetrain longevity, we've now opened the door to the judgement call. Therefore, when Billy Bob drags his mud-caked, BullyDog'd, PowerChip'd super-dooper-pooper-scooper'd-up on 35's PowerJoke F350 into the dealer with a busted U-joint and screams 'warranty!," the precedent will have been set for the manufacturer to prove that Billy Bob's 'modifications' are responsible for the failure. Bullshat - hillbilly abused the truck, it broke, hillbilly pays the bill -- it's not FoMoCo's problem to prove liability.

That example is a clear case of owner abuse and I do not disagree that the auto maker should not be held accountable for repairs. That is fair. If the owner beats the hell out of their vehicle and breaks it then yes it is their fault. However a conservative tune that poses very little threat to the longevity of the vehicle I don't feel should be grounds to automatically throw the warranty out the door.

I personally feel the real issue going on here is GM is hurting dollar wise and they are looking for ways to stop the bleeding. Of course those cuts come at the consumers expense. I do believe a few of the big executives took some big pay cuts. Get some more of the higher up executives to take pay cuts. Its either take a pay cut and have employment or say no and risk standing in the unemployment line. I understand GM has to make changes to become a more profitable company and have no issues with them trying. Just don't resort to overusing moves that will drive customers away. Looking for ways to wessle out of warranty claims will not endear them to customers.

[Ajaxus]

Originally Posted by Mike Jung

I guess...I am going to wait after 5-years to tune my PCM

Discuss.

Buy two pcm's.

Problem solved?