Test drove an '04 GTO

[Mike3800]

Originally Posted by Vintalage

Uh oh, you've done it now.

My bad... but it was an honest sugggestion. Seriously you should.

I have driven several Mustangs old n/a Cobra 5-speed, old GT 5-speed and old V6 5-speed. I have driven a Camaro V6 5-speed and automatic, Camaro Z28SS manual and a base Z28 automatic and manual and a Corvette automatic as well. Still have the GTO on the list.

[Vintalage]

Originally Posted by GTPprix

The Monaro (and subsequent HSV models) are Holdens euro fighters in AUS and other markets like the UAE and the UK. Cost wise I still fail to see how people bitch about the car being 33K, I know it's not cheap but the closest GM cars to compare it to would be the old F-Cars for powertrain alone and the Grand Prix. The F-Cars were about 29-30K loaded and a Grand Prix loaded can be had for about 30K as well albeit with more features than the GTO.

It REALLY pi$$es the aussies off to listen to people bitch about the GTO being too expensive, while it's not cheap I honestly think the 33K sticker is quite fair when you consider the quality and features you get relative to other *GM* models. Why does it pi$$ the aussies off so much you ask? Because simply put the base Monaro STARTS at $42,950 USD! While they do have other options I would love to have such as dual zone, sunroof, navigation ect, up until this year they ALWAYS had less powerful engines to boot! So to be quite frank the GTO is a hell of a deal in most of the western worlds eyes at our sticker prices.

I was thinking about this today as I sat in one while my car was being serviced. I listened to the way the door shuts and it's a more mellow thud than that of my Grand am and the G6 that was in the showroom. I looked at the interior and wow, it is extremely well put together. It has a quality interior. However, I don't see them going for 33k. I see them going for $37 - $39k and for that price, it's not worth it seeing as how it's simply a base car. The only car I can compare the GTO to is the 300C and possibly the Magnum. Similar performance, more features. $40k tops loaded. Now the 300c/Magnum isn't available with a stick but still, that's tough competition. The other thing is if i'm not mistaken, in Australia, this car undercuts all the other offerings there. That is why it's so popular. It's the best bang for your buck. But GM brings it over here and it's overpriced.

Anyhow, this car is on my list. I plan to go for another spin this weekend. The dealership I dropped my car off for service only had 1 left and it was in the showroom. Going for $29k

By the way, I'm without my car yet again.

[BLEE]

Originally Posted by PontiacGT2K

I've had the same experience

i dont think he wass referring to older bmws...its the newer ones that supposedly dont have as good reliablity. of course im not talking from experience since i dont own any newer bmws but their reliability supposedly went down.

[Mike3800]

Originally Posted by Vintalage

By the way, I'm without my car yet again.

You should trade the thing.

Originally Posted by Vintalage

By the way, I'm without my car yet again.

Cut your losses and purchase a new car. Your GA is not worth all the pain it has caused you.

[AMRAAM4]

Originally Posted by Vintalage

I was thinking about this today as I sat in one while my car was being serviced. I listened to the way the door shuts and it's a more mellow thud than that of my Grand am and the G6 that was in the showroom. I looked at the interior and wow, it is extremely well put together. It has a quality interior. However, I don't see them going for 33k. I see them going for $37 - $39k and for that price, it's not worth it seeing as how it's simply a base car. The only car I can compare the GTO to is the 300C and possibly the Magnum. Similar performance, more features. $40k tops loaded. Now the 300c/Magnum isn't available with a stick but still, that's tough competition. The other thing is if i'm not mistaken, in Australia, this car undercuts all the other offerings there. That is why it's so popular. It's the best bang for your buck. But GM brings it over here and it's overpriced.

Anyhow, this car is on my list. I plan to go for another spin this weekend. The dealership I dropped my car off for service only had 1 left and it was in the showroom. Going for $29k

By the way, I'm without my car yet again.

Dude, I told you if you need to find a GTO to let me know. I can try and help you!! If you owe on your GAGT, don't get any GM discount, or don't have a GM card with earnings...then of course you aren't going to get that low a price!

[PontiacGT2K]

Originally Posted by BLEE

i dont think he wass referring to older bmws...its the newer ones that supposedly dont have as good reliablity. of course im not talking from experience since i dont own any newer bmws but their reliability supposedly went down.

I've only had experience with newer BMW's.

[SC/TGrandAm]

New and old BMW's here. From my experience the newer ones are more reliable than the older ones. Although the older ones that Ive been around never had any major issues or anything as major as a window regulator breaking ...

[PontiacGT2K]

Or rotors warping every 10k miles.....intake manifold gaskets going bad constantly....water pump going bad.....streaking windows.....premature blown tranny......so on.

Honestly, other than brake bads and what not, I haven't seen anything replaced or repaired on any of the Beamers we've owned....and that's with me beating the snot out of them.

[monaroCountry]

Overseas Review

Road test - Vauxhall Monaro
[December 18 2003]

You have to feel a little sorry for Vauxhall as it thrashes around in the General Motors catalogue, trying to find something we might actually want to buy. First of all, they decided to import a selection of cars like the Cadillac Seville and Corvette from America, but this ended badly. Even Vauxhall says "We know everyone who bought one by name". So now they're trying their luck with a car made in Australia.

On the face of it, this sounds even more hare-brained because Australia is not exactly ground zero when it comes to engineering innovation or excellence. Indeed, in the country's entire 200 year history, their only contribution has been the rotary washing line.

There are no Aussie planes, no Aussie food blenders or cameras or microwave ovens. Even my barbecue set was made in Canada. And, so far as cars are concerned, it's even worse. There was a bloke called James Holden who started out making saddles for horses and then after just 10 years of making motorcycle side cars was bought out by General Motors. And then presumably went to join the rest of the continent in the pub.

Nonetheless, today, there are still cars that bear his name and one of them has been singled out by Vauxhall as The Next Big Thing to hit Britain. God knows why. Choosing to buy an Australian car is a bit like choosing to drink a German wine. Why do you think all Australian motoring journalists end up over here? Because there's bugger all to do at home. Cars. It's just not what they do well.

However, I decided to have a look at the thing which, in the flesh, is like a two-door Vauxhall Omega, only much much bigger. Its proportions may work well in the Northern Territory but in Surrey, at our test track, it felt like a whale shark in a goldfish bowl.

I shalln't bore you with the styling details because there weren't any. And anyway, you can judge for yourselves. But for what it's worth, I thought it was quite handsome in an inoffensive, didn't-really-notice-it, sort of way.

You can probably tell from my tone here that I wasn't expecting the Monaro to be much cop. I felt it was a bit like going round for dinner with people who only know you because your kids are in the same class. You know you're in for an evening of mind-bending tedium.

But when I went through the door of the Monaro, it had a bit of a surprise up its sleeve. Tons of recreational drugs, and why don't you help yourself to my daughter while you're at it. This car is enormous, rounded, proper, wide-eyed, teeth-bared, stomach-flittering fun with a big, loud F.

Up front, you get the Corvette's 5.7-litre V8 which sends its 339bhp down a prop shaft and to the rear wheels via a limited slip differential. For those of you used to active yaw control from your Evo VIII or two-stage turbocharging from your Porsche, the Monaro will seem like switching to shepherd's pie after a week at the Peach and Pea****. But trust me on this, it works.

So far as speed's concerned, it goes from 0-60mph in 5.8 seconds and doesn't run out of crocodile rock until it hits 168. That makes it 1mph faster than the Lotus Carlton and, thus, the fastest Vauxhall ever. I know that's like winning the title of 'Bedford's most interesting accountant', but I raced it against a Jaguar XKR and it was extraordinary. The Jag leaped off the line like... well, like a Jaguar actually, while the Monaro was bogged down by an absurdly tall first gear.

But as the cars ate up the runway, the Aussie kept on gaining and gaining until at the braking point one mile down the road, they were dead level. That, then, is what you'd expect. American style straight line oomph from what, after all, is an American engine. There's an American style burble too, but there's nothing even remotely American about the way the Monaro corners. Which is remarkable when you remember it comes from a land with fewer bends than an Etch a Sketch drawing.

<b>Turn in, add a splash of power and within moments, it will serve up the most delicious smoked power slide in the history of Top Gear's test track. The BMW Z4 was easy to handle down there. The Mazda RX-8 was better still (in the dry at least), but the Monaro was a whole new ball game. Sticking with ball games, the gulf between this and the aforementioned Jag is as big as the gulf between our rugby team and theirs. Only this time, they win. The Monaro is effortless hooliganism. </b>



But when you settle down, the car does too. The seats that held you in place so marvellously on the track turn into armchairs, the ride is weirdly compliant, the steering is light and, because the engine has enough torque to uproot James May in an argument (probably, it's never actually been achieved), you can stick it in sixth and potter home at three, doing hundreds of miles to the gallon.

Inside, you get space for four and electric everything. The only thing that's missing is satellite navigation. But then it's only going to cost £28,500 when it goes on sale next May. To sum up then, damn. Damn, damn, damn and double damn.

I was rather hoping to hate the Holden. I was hoping to conclude by saying the Aussies should stick to waving at flies. And I was dying to poke some more fun at Vauxhall for making yet another half-arsed and useless decision.

But the Monaro is a wonderful car. Too big, too brash and too loud, for some, perhaps. I can't see too many outside Chipping Norton church on a Sunday, for instance. But if you have an electric blue Subaru now, or a banana yellow 911, and fancy something a bit different next time round, you shouldn't give a XXXX for anything else.


Jeremy Clarkson

[Vintalage]

Visited another dealer today to drive one in the daytime. I went to the back of the place first and surveyed the lot.





I couldn't believe how many they had. A total of 9 GTOs (1 of them not pictured above or below. The car pictured below is the one missing from the second pic. It should be inbetween the yellow and silver cars)! I drove to the front and went in. Asked to test drive a GTO auto. The salesman copied my license and grabbed the keys to this guy which happened to be in front at the time:




My favorite color. He said he would drive it first and then we would swap. Ok by me. He told me to buckle up. With those words, I knew what he was planning to do. He floored it right out of the dealership. The tires chiped as he did this. I didn't get to test drive the other one like this so OMG, that was quick. He pushed that thing. When it was time to swap, a guy who was passing blew his horn and gave us the He witnessed the power the GTO layed down. I gave him the thumbs up to confirm. That was pretty cool. When I got on the street, I knew then that the auto is a definate no no. I hit the pedal slightly then floored it, and it wouldn't get out of 2nd gear. Then when I chrped the tires, it immediately upshifted to 2nd and stayed there. I was like "boo!" But I did get to floor it in first and I was astonished.

I drove back to the lot and parked it. The salesman asked if I wanted him to take the Black M6 (that was also in the front of the dealership) out to see what that is like. He said he'd show me how the manual is. I said sure. This paticular M6 (the one not pictured) had $5,000 worth of mods according to the salesman. From what I could see, it had rims (by TCS or TZS?), exhaust, and tint. It was used by the owner's son. He modded it, but had to give it back once he hit 4,000 miles. So it's a demo. The mods were tasteful. This one was significantly louder. I heard both the auto and the modded gto at the same time idling and driving. The GTO M6 sounded fantastic. He took me for a ride, a fast ride. All i've got to say is the M6 is the way to go, at least for me. I could feel the difference. More control which I already knew. The car received a few looks from kids when we drove through a residential neighborhood. One of them pointed at it and stared as we came to a stop sign. It also got some looks when the salesman revved the engine while at a light. Quite interesting.

I'm definately hooked. But it's a difficult decision given I loose some things to gain the HP/torque advantage. And i'd hate to loose those things. I'll have to think about this real well.

[fo44rd]

Originally Posted by PontiacGT2K

Or rotors warping every 10k miles.....intake manifold gaskets going bad constantly....water pump going bad.....streaking windows.....premature blown tranny......so on.

Honestly, other than brake bads and what not, I haven't seen anything replaced or repaired on any of the Beamers we've owned....and that's with me beating the snot out of them.

Yeah gotta love the Quality and Pride that goes into making each one. This is why GM is constantly changing names on cars: they drag the reputation of a particular name in the mud with corner cutting build technique and then parlay part of the profits of doing such to the marketing department for the next model.

THINK HOW GOOD THE GA COULD HAVE BEEN IF THEY JUST USED THE G6 ADVERTISING BUDGET TO MAKE THE GRAND AM BETTER DURING ITS MODEL RUN!!!!!! THEY WOULDN'T BE CHANGING NAMES.

[Vintalage]

Originally Posted by fo44rd

Yeah gotta love the Quality and Pride that goes into making each one. This is why GM is constantly changing names on cars: they drag the reputation of a particular name in the mud with corner cutting build technique and then parlay part of the profits of doing such to the marketing department for the next model.

THINK HOW GOOD THE GA COULD HAVE BEEN IF THEY JUST USED THE G6 ADVERTISING BUDGET TO MAKE THE GRAND AM BETTER DURING ITS MODEL RUN!!!!!! THEY WOULDN'T BE CHANGING NAMES.

You're right. And this is part of the reason the GTO isn't selling too well. The pontiac image has been tarnished. I was talking to a woman who owned a pontiac sunbird back in '91 and it gave her hell. Because of her experience, she said she will never own another pontiac again. She said the only cars that are worth while from GM are their luxury cars. I think alot of people feel this way. They don't have money to waste on a mediocore product. It's alot of money and when your making such a big purchase, your taking a gamble. You don't know how reliable it is.

I'm looking at the GTO because I know it's built well and has the quality that I expect from a car.

[Mike3800]

Originally Posted by Vintalage

I'm looking at the GTO because I know it's built well and has the quality that I expect from a car.

Still has the Pontiac name and will eventually get it's resale.

I honestly think it will have the same reliability I have seen with most GM cars, meaning it will be above average but not outstanding.

[Vintalage]

Originally Posted by Mike3800

Still has the Pontiac name and will eventually get it's resale.

You need a snotty BMW or something, those are fast too, American Iron is not your thing, from all the things you have said it seems you should have no business with an American car of any kind.

Maybe not. I don't think like you. You want crap. I don't.

GTO is not a full fledge american car. Monaro was built to be a BMW fighter. BMW doesn't mean simply performance. It means luxury, sport, handling, and performance. Just so you know.

[UNCTYPE-S]

those kids were staring probably cause they didnt think a stratus, i mean gto, could sound like that.

[AMRAAM4]

The manual is also a lot better on gas mileage, about 4-5 miles per gallon better.

[AMRAAM4]

Originally Posted by UNCTYPE-S

those kids were staring probably cause they didnt think a stratus, i mean gto, could sound like that.

We all can't be blessed enough to feel masculine driving a bland, wannabe yuppy, bitch car.

[UNCTYPE-S]

you forgot to enter "IMO" in your post.

You might wanna edit.

yes we all cant blessed like i am. im sorry you werent. i guess you will just have to settle with the so exciting looking gto.

[silentalero]

wow, so now im preppy becasue i drive a CL?

time to go drag ass to get my manhood back i guess