GrandAmGT.com Forum
http://www.pfyc.com GrandAmGT.com Premium Memership Signup
CustomCarGrills.com   

Go Back   GrandAmGT.com Forum > GAGT - Technical - Sponsored by www.MilzyMotorSports.com > Technical Q&A

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-08-2006, 07:56 AM   #21
swordfencer
GAGT - Member
 
AKA: c
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 320
Vehicle: 2007 4Runner V8 SE
swordfencer Gettin' there
Send a message via AIM to swordfencer
I thought I was the only one that had this problem. My car will get all the way up to 230+ and the fans will not come on. I took in to the dealer to have them check and they said the computer is working fine. They did say that the temp gauge was reading a little high vs what the scan tool was saying. But still, it seems to happen at random that the fans will not kick on.

BTW, if I am not mistaken, the reason why our cars run hot is to lower emissions.
swordfencer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2006, 08:00 AM   #22
nascarnate326
Honda CRF 450
 
nascarnate326's Avatar
 
AKA: Nathan
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Age: 27
Posts: 1,188
Vehicle: 2004 Grand Prix GT
nascarnate326 Gettin' there
Send a message via AIM to nascarnate326
Quote:
Originally Posted by coupe
Ive always wondered why these cars run so damn hot.
I have owned 7 cars in my 24 years. This is the ONLY one that gets way to hot for comfort just by idleing.
My truck for instance, i can let that lumber wagon idle in a 100 degree day and the temp wont budge over 180 no matter what. Yet my GA i let it idle on a 60 degree day and within 10 minutes the temp is touching 230 and still rising!!!
My GA would do the exact same thing. I trued to keep airflow moving as much as possible, but with 1 and 2 not working 3 was a lil loud. My Cavi will sit all day at 195 (nocks on wood). Hopefully this problem doesnt happen to the G6 people in a few years.
__________________
"We've got lots of letters from Windows users that say iTunes is their favorite program. Its like giving a glass of water to someone in hell" - Steve Jobs
nascarnate326 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2006, 09:18 AM   #23
Mike Jung
400 hp & 410 lb-ft
 
Mike Jung's Avatar
 
AKA: Mike
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,670
Vehicle: '14 Camaro SS RS coupe
Mike Jung a trusted member
Quote:
Originally Posted by nascarnate326
My GA would do the exact same thing. I trued to keep airflow moving as much as possible, but with 1 and 2 not working 3 was a lil loud...
What are you talking about

What does (I am guessing) the HVAC blower fan have to do with the engine coolant fans ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nascarnate326
...My Cavi will sit all day at 195...
& your 2.4L Twin Cam 4-cylinder engine also has a 180°F/82°C thermostat.

PS: Does your Z-24 actually have #'s on your engine coolant temp gauge ?
I know that the '98 Sunfire GT doesn't; just a ok range on the gauge.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by kse73 View Post
If knowledge was power, Mike Jung would be Stalin
Quote:
Originally Posted by iceman View Post
you ****in scare me sometimes, jung
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramair4thesoul View Post
..." hey MJ want to have hot, sweaty, passionate sex. I'll let you do things to me you just dream about now. Oh, I give porn head and my boobs are amazing." ...

Last edited by Mike Jung; 05-08-2006 at 09:25 AM.
Mike Jung is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2006, 09:26 AM   #24
lone_wolf025
Spirit guides
 
lone_wolf025's Avatar
 
AKA: Jon
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Age: 31
Posts: 3,130
Vehicle: 2003 Grand Am GT1
lone_wolf025 Gettin' there
Send a message via AIM to lone_wolf025
The HVAC system has a mini radiator of sorts buried in the firewall. Its hooked up to the coolant system and when air is blown across it, from having the temp select knob on heat, it will drop the temperature of the coolant.
__________________
A lack of something better

Never ask why people do strange/stupid things...the answer just makes it worse...

14.841 @91.56mph


Quote:
Originally Posted by Someone else
Ahhh but that would be in the land of "Makes Sense"...you forget that we live in the land of "DUHHH"
lone_wolf025 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2006, 10:56 AM   #25
andrewe77
GAGT - Member
 
AKA: Andrew
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Blue Springs, MO
Posts: 162
Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT Coupe
andrewe77 Gettin' there
AKA the heater core
andrewe77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2006, 01:29 AM   #26
JackNBeth
Import Killer in '93
 
JackNBeth's Avatar
 
AKA: Trey
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cleveland, OH
Age: 37
Posts: 3
Vehicle: 2002 Grand Am GT1
JackNBeth Gettin' there
As to a question on Page 1, "Why do these GAs run so hot?". I asked this very question back in 2000 with my 99 GT1 to a GM plant here in Cleveland, OH. They told me to come in since I was a resident, and my grandfather worked for them for 17 years. I was told that any of the Grand Ams that were originally built with the "Ram Air" package, the engine depends on the air intake from the inlets on the package to keep the engine cool. So, keeping the car running and moving is a must. It's not the best car for heat and traffic. It's better for cruising and racing upgrades. Also, I was told that I should NEVER install a short-ram intake in the car, no matter what. It cuts off more air than doing any good, besides it just lets in engine and exhaust air. The best suggestion that they gave me was to keep the stock "Ram Air" intake, and do mods to the other intake into the Air Box. This is the one that has the Air Dampener on it, located in the front fender wall. I was told to find a better way to extend the pipe to the fender, and make a few mods on the car that involve cutting the fender at the two small indents and opening up the square hole in the air box to a round "diagonal" hole. Then attach a hose from the fender to the air box. Very recommended to find a way to put a filter on the inside of pipe. You can use the screen in front of the MAP Sensor or a cut one out of a house furnace filter. This has not been determined to add performace to the car, because I could not get a straight answer and I haven't been able to get mine done yet. All it was designed to do is add colder air to the engine.
JackNBeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2006, 04:38 AM   #27
rocketfast123
Was i drunk that day
 
rocketfast123's Avatar
 
AKA: Tater Salad
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Montgomery,Al
Age: 28
Posts: 1,362
Vehicle: 2001Alero 2.4(5-speed)
rocketfast123 Gettin' there
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Jung
& your 2.4L Twin Cam 4-cylinder engine also has a 180F/82C thermostat.

PS: Does your Z-24 actually have #'s on your engine coolant temp gauge ?
I know that the '98 Sunfire GT doesn't; just a ok range on the gauge.
My 2.4 will go halfway between 1/2 and 3/4 mark, but that's only on a hot day waiting at a red light. Once it get's that high I guess the t-stat opens to drop the temp, because the fans don't turn on. Now with the a/c on 98 degrees with 100% humidity it will stay at 1/2 mark all day.
__________________
Will (can't type!) Two Cams are twice as fun.
Hauler: 1984 Buick Electra Estate Wagon Olds 3oh7. 268H camming
"Used car dealers are scum of the earth, and the more ball-busting you can do to them, the more I salute you. If he won't budge, let it sit a couple of weeks, then go in and offer him $750, reminding him that he won't get jack **** for it at auction."
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepyalero View Post
I could be wrong, but if you keep clearing the code with the OBDII scanner, it will keep coming back until the problem is solved.
rocketfast123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2006, 02:31 PM   #28
timka86
6 Speed GT
 
timka86's Avatar
 
AKA: Tim
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Glendale Heights, IL
Age: 28
Posts: 645
Vehicle: 2005 G35 Sedan 6MT
timka86 Gettin' there
Send a message via MSN to timka86
well add me on to this list of people's fans not working. still no one mentions a way of fixing it. whoever replaced the PCM, did it work?
__________________
EX-Owner and builder of the first ever 6 SPEED GRAND AM
http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/showthread.php?t=73212
timka86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 01:20 AM   #29
Sprucegagt
Schwartz Power!
 
Sprucegagt's Avatar
 
AKA: Andy
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Ranson, WV
Age: 39
Posts: 2,027
Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT
Sprucegagt a trusted member
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackNBeth
As to a question on Page 1, "Why do these GAs run so hot?". I asked this very question back in 2000 with my 99 GT1 to a GM plant here in Cleveland, OH. They told me to come in since I was a resident, and my grandfather worked for them for 17 years. I was told that any of the Grand Ams that were originally built with the "Ram Air" package, the engine depends on the air intake from the inlets on the package to keep the engine cool. So, keeping the car running and moving is a must. It's not the best car for heat and traffic. It's better for cruising and racing upgrades. Also, I was told that I should NEVER install a short-ram intake in the car, no matter what. It cuts off more air than doing any good, besides it just lets in engine and exhaust air. The best suggestion that they gave me was to keep the stock "Ram Air" intake, and do mods to the other intake into the Air Box. This is the one that has the Air Dampener on it, located in the front fender wall. I was told to find a better way to extend the pipe to the fender, and make a few mods on the car that involve cutting the fender at the two small indents and opening up the square hole in the air box to a round "diagonal" hole. Then attach a hose from the fender to the air box. Very recommended to find a way to put a filter on the inside of pipe. You can use the screen in front of the MAP Sensor or a cut one out of a house furnace filter. This has not been determined to add performace to the car, because I could not get a straight answer and I haven't been able to get mine done yet. All it was designed to do is add colder air to the engine.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

This has to be a joke. Anyone who has even bothered to check the routing of the "RAM AIR" ducting would know that it has zero effect on the cooling system. Whoever talked to you at that GM plant clearly had no idea what they were talking about.

As for the fan issue, well unless you know someone that has tuning software or your willing to install a bypass switch, your stuck with the stock settings. My car used to have this problem even with the 180 tstat I installed. But Powrtuner changed all of that. Needle has never touched the 200 mark since then, even with 95 * outside temps.
__________________
2000 Grand Am GT (some day it will be SC/T)
Mods: alot
Sprucegagt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 05:25 AM   #30
lvemy3100
Im President Charley
 
lvemy3100's Avatar
 
AKA: Mark
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Round Lake, IL
Posts: 2,040
Vehicle: 2001 TURBO Alero
lvemy3100 a trusted member
Send a message via AIM to lvemy3100
tuning software dosent do anything to cure this issue.... we tired (me and timka86)

the fans are somehow malfunctioning.....
__________________
-Mark


You want more power? You need MP Racing!

------

Now drink with me deeply of the bourbon, scotch, and rye until such time as we are fighting drunk. Then we shall find, and beat the a**es of, the nonbelievers who ruined my feast.
lvemy3100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 07:58 AM   #31
brim
GAGT - Member
 
brim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Warwick, RI
Age: 32
Posts: 225
Vehicle: 1999 Alero GL Coupe
brim Gettin' there
Send a message via AIM to brim
for some reason i didn't think there was an easy fix the issue
__________________
-brim
brim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 08:57 AM   #32
coupe
lick it
 
coupe's Avatar
 
AKA: Rand
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Grand Rapids, Mi
Age: 33
Posts: 7,347
Vehicle: 99 GAGT/96 Z71/05 R6
coupe a trusted member
Im not overly worried since i have caspers fan switch.
__________________
CarDomain.com
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm...endID=31690558
he has asserted his dominance over competing males with the loud masculine sound form his exaust system, Females searching for a potential mate will be driven away by weaker exaust systems and attracted to his SLP.
coupe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 12:55 PM   #33
timka86
6 Speed GT
 
timka86's Avatar
 
AKA: Tim
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Glendale Heights, IL
Age: 28
Posts: 645
Vehicle: 2005 G35 Sedan 6MT
timka86 Gettin' there
Send a message via MSN to timka86
I don't have a fan switch, so i turn on the A/C and that turns the fans on, and they stay on after you turn the A/C off, but that puts wear on my A/C clutch.

basically it would be nice to not have to watch the temp guage. it looks like all of us that are having this problem are 00 or 99.

so if i get a 2001 + PCM, could it be programmed and work with my 2000 GA?

it could be a 2000 and 99 PCM issue.
__________________
EX-Owner and builder of the first ever 6 SPEED GRAND AM
http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/showthread.php?t=73212
timka86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 01:16 PM   #34
coupe
lick it
 
coupe's Avatar
 
AKA: Rand
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Grand Rapids, Mi
Age: 33
Posts: 7,347
Vehicle: 99 GAGT/96 Z71/05 R6
coupe a trusted member
It would be less headache to just buy a capsers fan switch, plus you get a cool toggle switch and a cool little led light.
__________________
CarDomain.com
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm...endID=31690558
he has asserted his dominance over competing males with the loud masculine sound form his exaust system, Females searching for a potential mate will be driven away by weaker exaust systems and attracted to his SLP.
coupe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 01:52 PM   #35
brim
GAGT - Member
 
brim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Warwick, RI
Age: 32
Posts: 225
Vehicle: 1999 Alero GL Coupe
brim Gettin' there
Send a message via AIM to brim
Quote:
Originally Posted by coupe
It would be less headache to just buy a capsers fan switch, plus you get a cool toggle switch and a cool little led light.
, however it would be nice if it were not a problem at all
__________________
-brim
brim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 02:53 PM   #36
slowbird
GAGT - Member
 
slowbird's Avatar
 
AKA: Matt
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Brampton, Ontario
Posts: 294
Vehicle: 2004 Grand Am GT Sedan
slowbird Gettin' there
My 04 on average sits a tick above 90*c which is the halfway mark.

Like others have said...if I let the card idle for a bit the temp will go between the 1/2 mark and the 2/3 Mark. My fans don't come on...not even with the MMS PCM....though they do stay on after key off for 3 minutes.

I use the A/C in summer so that helps keep the car cool.

I need to get that fan switch.
__________________
-Matt
2004 Grand Am GT

14.860@90.86mph.
N/A, Full Interior...No Headers.
slowbird is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 03:33 PM   #37
Sprucegagt
Schwartz Power!
 
Sprucegagt's Avatar
 
AKA: Andy
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Ranson, WV
Age: 39
Posts: 2,027
Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT
Sprucegagt a trusted member
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvemy3100
tuning software dosent do anything to cure this issue.... we tired (me and timka86)

the fans are somehow malfunctioning.....
If the relays are functioning properly and power is available to the fans if you jump the relay then it has to be the PCM. I know DHP added class II fan enabling through the PT for Grand Ams. This fixed my problem where the fans would not activate at my revised temp. settings. Does your Malibu have this option?
__________________
2000 Grand Am GT (some day it will be SC/T)
Mods: alot
Sprucegagt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 04:06 PM   #38
lvemy3100
Im President Charley
 
lvemy3100's Avatar
 
AKA: Mark
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Round Lake, IL
Posts: 2,040
Vehicle: 2001 TURBO Alero
lvemy3100 a trusted member
Send a message via AIM to lvemy3100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprucegagt
If the relays are functioning properly and power is available to the fans if you jump the relay then it has to be the PCM. I know DHP added class II fan enabling through the PT for Grand Ams. This fixed my problem where the fans would not activate at my revised temp. settings. Does your Malibu have this option?

as far as I know most files should have that option....

the issue is with tims ga NOT my malibu....

we lowered his temps before and everything was working just fine ... he just finished his rebuild and came back to get the newest file from me with his fan turn on points since he used a 180 t-stat and now we are having this problem.... we didnt mess with the "class II fan enabling" the first time around or this time and considering the issue is with other un-tuned GA's something tells me the flash had nothing to do with the fan issue... I could be wrong but I cant say for sure till Tim has time to let me take another crack at this issue...

his car was the first I had ever saw or heard of this issue and then I found this thread while trying to find some sorta explanation as to wtf is going on...

the casper's fan switch is a good idea and is an easy fix but I would really like to get to the root of the issue so that people that are having this issue now and in the future can identify and fix it without having to deal with a mechanic
__________________
-Mark


You want more power? You need MP Racing!

------

Now drink with me deeply of the bourbon, scotch, and rye until such time as we are fighting drunk. Then we shall find, and beat the a**es of, the nonbelievers who ruined my feast.
lvemy3100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 04:50 PM   #39
timka86
6 Speed GT
 
timka86's Avatar
 
AKA: Tim
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Glendale Heights, IL
Age: 28
Posts: 645
Vehicle: 2005 G35 Sedan 6MT
timka86 Gettin' there
Send a message via MSN to timka86
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvemy3100
as far as I know most files should have that option....

the issue is with tims ga NOT my malibu....

we lowered his temps before and everything was working just fine ... he just finished his rebuild and came back to get the newest file from me with his fan turn on points since he used a 180 t-stat and now we are having this problem.... we didnt mess with the "class II fan enabling" the first time around or this time and considering the issue is with other un-tuned GA's something tells me the flash had nothing to do with the fan issue... I could be wrong but I cant say for sure till Tim has time to let me take another crack at this issue...

his car was the first I had ever saw or heard of this issue and then I found this thread while trying to find some sorta explanation as to wtf is going on...

the casper's fan switch is a good idea and is an easy fix but I would really like to get to the root of the issue so that people that are having this issue now and in the future can identify and fix it without having to deal with a mechanic
i believe i had this issue before the rebuild and before any tuning. because last summer, when i bought the car, it would get hot at red lights, and cool off when i was moving, and it also was cooler when i had the A/C on, which puzzled me cuz i figured, with the A/C on it should make it hotter. so this is a PCM issue for sure.

i was at the dealer today, the 99-00 PCM's have a diff part# then the 01-04 PCM's. all the guy could tell me is that there was a difference in the transmission, probably in the line pressure and shift timing, but not for sure.

here's the part #:
99-00: 09380717
01-04: 12209614

could anyone find out the changes made from 00 to 01?
__________________
EX-Owner and builder of the first ever 6 SPEED GRAND AM
http://www.grandamgt.com/forum/showthread.php?t=73212
timka86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2006, 09:43 PM   #40
Sprucegagt
Schwartz Power!
 
Sprucegagt's Avatar
 
AKA: Andy
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Ranson, WV
Age: 39
Posts: 2,027
Vehicle: 2000 Grand Am GT
Sprucegagt a trusted member
I know one hardware change is the O2 sensor. But nothing on the cooling fans. You can run an 01 bin file on a 00 GA. But you have to disable the DTC for O2 heat up time. The O2 sensor in the 01+ models warm up quicker than the 99 and 00 models.

Having the AC "on" automatically turns on fan 1. Thus cooling the car down when the AC is on. How hot did your car get?
__________________
2000 Grand Am GT (some day it will be SC/T)
Mods: alot
Sprucegagt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2011 GrandAmGT.com
CustomCarGrills.com