Challenge! First Person To 11's

[tejohnson]

Lotsa secrets here .... I've just been so full of them.

Originally Posted by Babalouie

RSM did a fantastic job on my car. I'm having an issue with another companies product. Depending on how they handle this situation will determine whether or not I'll make a stink about it on this forum.

How about hopping on down to the Pontiac Nationals? Would be fun to have more Grand Am folks there this year...

[Sprucegagt]

Originally Posted by Babalouie

First off (for some people), I'm not here to take cheap shots for anyone. I don't care about anyone's concern or comments with RSM. They did a good job on my car and that's all that counts to me.

I am running 11.5:1 compression. Yes I'm a huge fan of high compression with forced induction. I don't want to start a debate on that topic thanks.

As for fuel mods, I do have larger injectors and an upgraded fuel pump.

RSM did not tune my car. I'm going to be using HP Tuners for the time being. If not, I may consider Electromotive Standalone unit.

I am going to be breaking in the engine NA once I get it back from my engine builder. Later on, I will put the supercharger back on and a custom intercooler that I built.

Lets get this straight.

1. The engine is making 11.5:1 compression yet you don't have it back from your engine builder to verify it.
2. You have not received this engine back from your engine builder, yet claimed to have had it for over a year.
3. It is 3.7 L yet you won't mention the bore or stroke.
4. You believe high compression and forced induction on a street engine is a good thing. Tell me do you think stock timing is good for it too?
5. I take it that since you have'nt tuned the engine, nor RSM, that if this engine has been running in the past that it was running on the stock PCM and code.


Sorry to point this out, but there are some things that just don't make sense.

[2002GT]

"subscribed"

[SikMindz]

Babalouie = "It's coming!"

[botlfed]

Originally Posted by SikMindz

Babalouie = "It's coming!"

Thank you Sik!!!

[Babalouie]

Originally Posted by SpyhunteR

Your engine builder? We are all under the impression that your engine builder was RSM?

11.5:1 compression and boost, how reliable do you see this setup being? Do you intend on running 93-100octane daily?

From going to 3.7L are you sure your cylinder walls aren't too thin to be able to handle the high compression PLUS boost? What's the target a/f ratio are you gunning for with such high compression and boost?

What sort of larger injectors are you talking about? Any specifics? or is it super duper secret?

RSM designed my engine and had it assembled at a engine machine shop. This shop has all of the lastest state of the art equipment for engine building. All of the numbers came from RSM.

I do not drive my car daily. I am aware that I require higher octane fuels. So for me to put in some 110octane in a car that I only drive once a week or so doesn't bother me. My committment. I'll see how things go to determine my a/f ratio.

I had my cylinder walls "sonic-tested". With this test, you will receive tolerance, clearances, stress points and all other sorts of units to determine if your walls will be too thin or not. I am confident that it will be able to tolerate the high compression and boost.

For na application, I had 32lbs injectors. When I had the charger on, I had 42lbs. My fuel pump is 256lph.

Yes, I did have this engine running in the past. I haven't had the car out in almost 2 years. I had other priorities that I had to finish as well as putting aside a budget. The engine came out for a couple of reasons. For one, I had a coolant leak. My lower intake manifold as to be re-surfaced. Secondly, I am adding a camshaft finally. I always had the stock cam.

I would love to go to Pontiac Nationals. I wanted to go last year. That event is on my priority list. I'll go to the Nationals over Albany. I enjoyed Albany, but I'd love to hit the nationals.

As for posting the numbers of the bore and stroke; Off hand I don't have the numbers. I can get them from RSM when I have time. I do have a copy of my sonic test kicking around here somewhere. I am still learning a lot about engine building, so please bare with me.

I hope that clears things up. Feel free to ask questions. I don't want this post to be one big debate forum. So lets get back on topic. Pm me if anything.

[Babalouie]

Originally Posted by Sprucegagt

Lets get this straight.

1. The engine is making 11.5:1 compression yet you don't have it back from your engine builder to verify it.
2. You have not received this engine back from your engine builder, yet claimed to have had it for over a year.
3. It is 3.7 L yet you won't mention the bore or stroke.
4. You believe high compression and forced induction on a street engine is a good thing. Tell me do you think stock timing is good for it too?
5. I take it that since you have'nt tuned the engine, nor RSM, that if this engine has been running in the past that it was running on the stock PCM and code.


Sorry to point this out, but there are some things that just don't make sense.

No, stock timing is not good. At the time when it ran, it was on the stock PCM. Now I can finally tune the damm thing right using the HP Tuner software.

[Sprucegagt]

Originally Posted by Babalouie

1. RSM designed my engine and had it assembled at a engine machine shop. This shop has all of the lastest state of the art equipment for engine building. All of the numbers came from RSM.

2. I do not drive my car daily. I am aware that I require higher octane fuels. So for me to put in some 110octane in a car that I only drive once a week or so doesn't bother me. My committment. I'll see how things go to determine my a/f ratio.

3. I had my cylinder walls "sonic-tested". With this test, you will receive tolerance, clearances, stress points and all other sorts of units to determine if your walls will be too thin or not. I am confident that it will be able to tolerate the high compression and boost.

4. For na application, I had 32lbs injectors. When I had the charger on, I had 42lbs. My fuel pump is 256lph.

5. Yes, I did have this engine running in the past. I haven't had the car out in almost 2 years. I had other priorities that I had to finish as well as putting aside a budget. The engine came out for a couple of reasons. For one, I had a coolant leak. My lower intake manifold as to be re-surfaced. Secondly, I am adding a camshaft finally. I always had the stock cam.

I would love to go to Pontiac Nationals. I wanted to go last year. That event is on my priority list. I'll go to the Nationals over Albany. I enjoyed Albany, but I'd love to hit the nationals.

6. As for posting the numbers of the bore and stroke; Off hand I don't have the numbers. I can get them from RSM when I have time. I do have a copy of my sonic test kicking around here somewhere. I am still learning a lot about engine building, so please bare with me.

7. I hope that clears things up. Feel free to ask questions. I don't want this post to be one big debate forum. So lets get back on topic. Pm me if anything.

1. Knowing how bad RSM's reputation is, I would have all of those numbers verified and backed up by the machine shop. I take it you also got a list of parts used from the machine shop as well as from RSM.

2. Your call on this one.

3. Think you could post the test results.

4. All of this with a stock PCM.

5. Is this the boost cam from Milzy or your own custom grind? If so could you post the cam specs?

6. Posting those specs will go along way in ending the debate you have had with different forum members. Most believe this displacement from a stock block is not possible. Throw in RSM's credibility issues and it really makes people wonder.

7. It's going in the right direction. Post up your specs and I'm sure the debate will end.

[bszopi]

Not to really help him out, but... RSM's cranks are just 3500 cranks that are ground down. Since the journals on the 3500 crank are bigger by 0.25", the crank can be offset ground to increase the stroke of the engine. So it is definately not just increasing the bore of the block. I haven't worked the numbers to see what it would take to get to 3.7L, but I'm pretty sure it is possible with the offset grind of the crank.

Depending on the head work and piston design, and if the quench area is good enough, its very possible to run high CR and boost, but it definately has to be tuned extremely well to run on just regular pump gas.

It'll be interesting to see, definately...

[aleroboy]

Originally Posted by bszopi

Not to really help him out, but... RSM's cranks are just 3500 cranks that are ground down. Since the journals on the 3500 crank are bigger by 0.25", the crank can be offset ground to increase the stroke of the engine. So it is definately not just increasing the bore of the block. I haven't worked the numbers to see what it would take to get to 3.7L, but I'm pretty sure it is possible with the offset grind of the crank.

Depending on the head work and piston design, and if the quench area is good enough, its very possible to run high CR and boost, but it definately has to be tuned extremely well to run on just regular pump gas.

It'll be interesting to see, definately...

thats jbody performance's crank
maybe rsm is doing that too
but first time this guy brought it up he said he got to a 3.7L with bore.
my motor is stroked 10mm and the bore is close to stock or one size over
my spec sheet is at the machine shop so I'm not exactly sure but i wanted my walls thick for boost.

[tejohnson]

And here I felt nervous going to 3.642...

[aleroboy]

Originally Posted by tejohnson

And here I felt nervous going to 3.642...

sad part is I'm still clearencing the block
i may have a very nice set of JE ashtrays if i hit bottom of the water jackets... but j-body told me they had done 3.8 strokers so i should be ok

[tejohnson]

How much more do you have to clear? Can you find more narrow rods? Those titanium rods that Julian (3x3) found would probably be helpfull...

[aleroboy]

its actually the rod bolt that hits
shouldn't have to clearence much honestly

[tejohnson]

We just cleared the rods a tad...

http://groomlakelabs.com/index.php?q...g2_itemId=2038

Block had to be clearanced near the oil filter.

http://groomlakelabs.com/index.php?q...g2_itemId=2094

The bolts would be quite another matter... All block work... Ewwww.

[aleroboy]

Originally Posted by tejohnson

We just cleared the rods a tad...

http://groomlakelabs.com/index.php?q...g2_itemId=2038

Block had to be clearanced near the oil filter.

http://groomlakelabs.com/index.php?q...g2_itemId=2094

The bolts would be quite another matter... All block work... Ewwww.

yeah its fun let me tell ya

[SpyhunteR]

Make it rev to 7000rpm!

[aleroboy]

Originally Posted by SpyhunteR

Make it rev to 7000rpm!

it will go higher than that
not sure I'll need to but it will

[AaronGTR]

Sure, you can run high compression and boost... but it's not smart and you can't run much boost. Maybe 5-6psi. If you run lower compression you can run higher boost and get more fuel and air into the cylinder before you reach the same cylinder pressures as running higher compression and lower boost. If you compare the power gains from compression increase compared to burning more air and fuel (given the same displacement for both) you'll see why most people opt to run lower compression and more boost. You make more power that way with less likely hood of blowing a head gasket. High comp and boost is just not a good idea.

[SpyhunteR]

Originally Posted by AaronGTR

Sure, you can run high compression and boost... but it's not smart and you can't run much boost. Maybe 5-6psi. If you run lower compression you can run higher boost and get more fuel and air into the cylinder before you reach the same cylinder pressures as running higher compression and lower boost. If you compare the power gains from compression increase compared to burning more air and fuel (given the same displacement for both) you'll see why most people opt to run lower compression and more boost. You make more power that way with less likely hood of blowing a head gasket. High comp and boost is just not a good idea.

High Compression and boost makes cars act bitchy. especially in las vegas heat, and I'm on a laughable 9.5:1 .... :-\